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The future of the sailing world. Why are there so few young people cruising??

119K views 908 replies 179 participants last post by  captain jack 
#1 ·
I'm curious on opinions on this one. When Baby boomers were in their 20's there were lots of them in small capable sailboats (some they made themselves) cruising across oceans; but now-a-days the majority of twenty-year olds appear to be utterly useless. I just don't get it, and I'm in my twenties, and cruising.


I'm also curious as to where people think the future of the sailing industry is going if there are so few young people involved?

Any thoughts?
 
#326 ·
I never said it was impossible... after all I have done it myself... and I am not making excuses for anybody. My point is it is now harder now than it was thirty years ago so their are fewer people willing to make the sacrifices necessary to do go cruising.

Time for me to move on to another thread! Have fun with this discussion.:D
 
#330 ·
My point is it is now harder now than it was thirty years ago so their are fewer people willing to make the sacrifices necessary to do go cruising.
discussion.:D
I agree with that. Plus, I'm not so sure cruising, as a lifestyle, is as popular with young people today as it was 30 years ago.

It was about 20 years ago my wife and I took off down the east coast for a year. That's the closest we ever came to what I think of as cruising. At that time, we were the youngest(early and middle 30's). Young people were NOT cruising then on the east coast. I think Hannah, a world cruiser posted that fact as well. However, he points out cruising is stronger and may be on the rise in other countries(nice to know).

Today, cruising means anything from globe girdling to weekend coastal sailing, to even simply living aboard, depending on who you're talking to. If the current and pretty well entrenched daysailer boat design era is any indicator, cruising may be on a flat line for a while for all age groups. What I consider "cruising" means a lifestyle commitment of at least a sabatical from work, home, shore side life. People are doing that these days, but they're doing it by traveling, going to school abroad, Woofing, etc. Same as cruising to me.

Living aboard is on the rise I think, and that's not a hard trend to understand. Boats are cheap, houses and apartments have been on a steep steady rise for decades(excepting the current blip that's fading). I think you'll see more of the younger generation looking into the liveaboard life style.

Sailing is connected to both cruising and living aboard(sometimes only faintly), but as a recreational pastime, sailing is as alive and well as it's ever been in my lifetime. All the old avenues that get people into it(like my family conduit), are still strong. I'd say locally, sailing clubs introducing youngsters to sailing, are stronger than they were when I was young.

And finally, sailing is part of a new and growing marine industry here in Maine which is boat building(all types and materials) and other maratime vocations. I see more and more kids going to "school" in the marine area. Many start as schooner bums working the many seasonal boats in our area(also a growing industry).
 
#328 ·
I'll give you two really good reasons that young people aren't cruising as much. You can sail for days then pull into the a small town only to find out the main street is covered with chains just like your town. Even when it's not chains it's still not the same as it was thirty years ago. I remember going down to my grand parents on the gulf and we would eat lot's of seafood. It was a treat because growing up in Arkansas we didn't get much seafood. No ocean and all. Now I live just outside of Dallas and there are seafood joints galore.

So traveling just a state or two away feels about the same as going out for the day then coming back and hitting your favorite restaurant. You can get BBQ in New England or Tacos in Wisconsin. Unless you've got months to sail, it's like you haven't even left your own harbor. Much easier to hop on a plane and fly down to Costa Rica for a real change of scenery, and a cheap vacation, then sail from Virginia up to Rhode Island only to eat at Joe's Crab Shack.

The second reason is that keeping a boat anywhere near the coast is crazy expensive. No 20 year old that doesn't work 80 hours a week can keep a boat with in a days trip to the inter-coastal or open water. It's not the seventies when the boat took some cash but you could find a good anchorage or tie it up for a few bucks. The keys are a prime example. I talked to guys that used to sail down in the 80's and you could get a slip on short notice for $20 a night. Now assuming you can find a slip it hundreds a night. Similar issue with house boat row. At one point there were dozens of house boats tied up along the canal between stock island and Key West. There are none left. EPA killed that party.

Same goes for new docks. It just about takes an act from the president to get permission to build any new docks. When I was in Hawaii, the boat I worked on moored out just short of a mile. There was an old dock that used to reach out to slighting deeper water that had been used to off load the crew and passengers. About three years before I got there, the company had purchased all the materials to rebuild the dock and tore off all the decking and some of the cross framing. Basically they figured that since they weren't replacing the pilings they didn't have to get any approval. They were wrong. The new decking material had sat for three years, growing weeds up through the piles. We just drove the boat in as far as we could and all the crew and passengers(Juvenile delinquents mostly) would wade in.

So between paying an arm and a leg to keep a boat anywhere near a good cruising spot, and traveling for days just to eat at the same restaurants and shop at the same brand name store, it's just not that attractive. I would rather sail on the weekends then fly some where truly different for vacation.
 
#329 ·
as far as keeping a boat....keeping a boat in addition to an house and all the other trappings of modern day life is expensive....but to live on a boat is one of the most cost effective ways to live. It only starts getting expensive when you pay other people to do stuff for you. Even up here, living in a marina, it costs less than it would cost to rent a room (not including utilities). Example slip for a 30' boat + live aboard fee + leash hold tax + environmental fee + power hook up fee = $290/mo, metered power in middle of winter with electric heat $50-60.....you can't find a room and/or house to share here for $350/mo plus utilites.
 
#331 · (Edited)
to some it up, the economy is a good excuse, but in reality it is the mindset of our culture....the "free spirits", the sort of people who would be willing to sail of into the tropical sunset can't afford to...to be able to afford to not only takes time, but channels people into the static mindset.
Marketing has a hand in it too, making us think we "need" a boat with all the gadgets, gizmos and gilhickies. A friend of mine cruised the Pacific single handed in a boat with a single burner camp stove, jerry jug water, bucket head, dysfunctional engine, hand held GPS, no winches, scary old galvanized rigging, sails w/ duct tape patches, lashed tiller self steer, etc....his annual cruising budget was about $2500. The Pardey's said "Go simple, go now"....I have seen alot of people waiting until they had the "perfect boat"....wait too long and never make it away.
Part of my plan in my cruise to the tropics, is to pick up a crew member (early to mid 20ish) I'll take care of everything....he wouldn't have to worry about anything.
 
#332 ·
I blame Hippity hop music. Find a person in ther early 20's who does'nt listen to exclusively Hip Hop music. It's all they know. 20 years ago when I was in my early 20's and living aboard/ cruising the Caribbean, we listend to a more organic, music orientated music, Kid's these day's want bling and ho's, not the slow, hard won satisfaction of dancing with nature. Even most of the young sailors of today are on racing circuts or kite boards. Playing at the beach I call it. There are a few young people with a call to the wild and a wander lust, as long as they can get service.
 
#334 ·
20 years ago when I was in my early 20's and living aboard/ cruising the Caribbean, we listend to a more organic, music orientated music,
Hang on.
20 years ago, in 1992-1993, Nirvana, Pearl Jam and Stone Temple Pilots ruled the airwaves with angry guitar driven grunge rock -
organic it wasn't. Cruising music it wasn't.
Meanwhile, hip hop stars Arrested Development had just rolled out their breakthrough album with the organic, melodic largely acoustic hits Tennessee, People Everyday, and Mr. Wendal.

So, maybe all hiphop ain't all the same. and neither is all the music from our youth.

Music is never as we remember it, and it is a reflection of a culture, not the cause of it.

All that being said, some stuff stands the test of time and crosses generations, and I think you might be onto something Capt. A, regarding musical choices and influences. For example, show me a kid listening to Bob Marley and I'll show you a potential cruiser.
 
#333 ·
Hip-hop and its atonal and unmelodic precursors are symptoms, not causes. The sounds of a generation and an era reflect what's going on in the minds and hearts of those making, and listening to, the sounds. The sounds of this time reveal that what is in those minds and hearts is not by-and-large good.

I blame the cities of man. All sorts of ills arise from urbanization. Right after the Flood, when mankind began to repopulate the Earth, they also began to clump up in what was then the vast well-watered and fertile valley surrounding the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. And build cities around those ziggurats.

Everyone familiar with Moseh knows the rest of the history, so clearly God doesn't approve of cities, and it seems clear He has good reasons.
 
#335 ·
Perhaps some of these attitudes are a bit of a deterrent when young 'uns show up at the marina? Bad enough having people me that their children are older than me but now you're going to assume I listen to hip hop? That's just over the line :p

It'd be nice for once to have someone assume my boat is mine, not my parents'. Sometimes people assume that what they expect is what they're seeing and it only reinforces their original ideas.

In any generation the majority aren't cruisers, so any assertions about the majority of a generation just aren't relevant. I could say lots of things about most of the boomers that are probably untrue of most of those owning a sailboat. Any comment about "kids these days" has just as much to do with young people who do (or in other circumstances would) own a sailboat.
 
#336 ·
When I was cruising as a young man, single handling around the Western Caribbean, no engine, no gadgets, I had a shaved head with a tattoo on it, I wore only a sarong, blaired live jam rock from the dead, grunge from seatle, reggae, hip hop, acid jazz, funk, classical, old timey folk etc. I was the quntessential, "un welcome in our marina" anti yachty, bare bones, boat kid and I loved it! Now, as I prepare the same little sloop, no engine, no gadgets, for an april departure to my house in Guanaja Honduras, I have the same taste in music only even more eclectic with a bit more trip hop in there, same tattoo on my head and same hair cut, I wear cargo shorts now, yet I still blame the bling, ho'ty ho ho culture of crotch rockets and stupid smart phones for this genertions general lack of interest in the organics of true live aboard cruising appeal . Of course there is a small group of 20 somethings out there in to it, but in general with out too much generalization, 20 somethings have different interests than my Gen did, generally speaking. All though kicking around Key West I see quite a few kids out there giving it the old college effort.
 
#337 ·
The town I live in is very static, either people have reached a level of success in thier life and don't want to go anywhere or they think if they hang around long enough they might succeed.
Of the people I have interviewed as prospective crew, the ones that had the right mindset were usually, surfers, skiers, climbers, etc...people whose life did not revolve around thier job and the trapping of modern day life...people who were more concerned with living life. Rather than achieving some sort of predetermined goal....what we are "supposed" to do with our life.
 
#338 ·
I can't believe what I'm reading here and a lot of old geasers should be ashamed of what they are saying. Hey and I'm an old geaser myself at 61 but where are you old farts sailing? The local pond or placid bay on weekends. I think there are more young out sailing than ever before. Just go over to SA forum and look on all the different sites not just the CA forum. Thousands of young people, most of them as sharp as can be and confident, racing in all types of boats and that is what young sailors should be doing. Having a great time going fast and learning how to sail a lot better than a lot of folks that are old farts can sail including myself and I aint bad.

And all of you folks with all these ideas that its electronics and laziness that they are all going to fall off the pier, what's up with you where is your head at. Your wrong, sorry to say it but you need to get out sailing and see all the young people around the world out having a real life and a great one, some with money and some with little. So what if 99.9 % of the young are clueless to sailing it has always been that way and always will be just like with old fart sailors who will never go anywhere except the pond they live on or down the bay they sail on. That is the way sailing has always been and will always be.

You should leave the young sailors alone because honestly you have no idea what you are talking about. Everywhere I look there are young families, young women, young men really sailing all over the world and having a lot better time than you are complaining about how the young don't sail because of this or that. This generation of 20 something is the best generation of 20 something I have ever met.

Sorry a just a little for the rant but get a life and meet some of these sailing young people and enjoy. I swear some of you must be dead or wish you were dead.
 
#341 · (Edited)
I can't believe what I'm reading here and a lot of old geasers should be ashamed of what they are saying. Hey and I'm an old geaser myself at 61 but where are you old farts sailing? The local pond or placid bay on weekends. I think there are more young out sailing than ever before. Just go over to SA forum and look on all the different sites not just the CA forum. Thousands of young people, most of them as sharp as can be and confident, racing in all types of boats and that is what young sailors should be doing. Having a great time going fast and learning how to sail a lot better than a lot of folks that are old farts can sail including myself and I aint bad.

And all of you folks with all these ideas that its electronics and laziness that they are all going to fall off the pier, what's up with you where is your head at. Your wrong, sorry to say it but you need to get out sailing and see all the young people around the world out having a real life and a great one, some with money and some with little. So what if 99.9 % of the young are clueless to sailing it has always been that way and always will be just like with old fart sailors who will never go anywhere except the pond they live on or down the bay they sail on. That is the way sailing has always been and will always be.

You should leave the young sailors alone because honestly you have no idea what you are talking about. Everywhere I look there are young families, young women, young men really sailing all over the world and having a lot better time than you are complaining about how the young don't sail because of this or that. This generation of 20 something is the best generation of 20 something I have ever met.

Sorry a just a little for the rant but get a life and meet some of these sailing young people and enjoy. I swear some of you must be dead or wish you were dead.
Well put. That's all true. You live in Hood River, so you are exposed to a much different crowd than say someone from...well, not there. Hood River is speacial and has a special bunch of adventure seeking young people. Key west is a lot like that. I have exposed many young people to the cruising scene, sailed many many backpackers around Central America over the last 20 years and still do. I've inspired countless people to buy their first boat and give it a shot. I was and still am the go to guy in key West when people young and old are looking. (There is a blue water, full keel, double ender at Robbies Marina for 500 bucks if any one is looking) I've brought 20 somethings to 60 somethings between Mexico and the Key's many times and am sailing down with my 72 year old father in law in april. I'm the youngest 42 year old on my block. My neighbor told me to pull my pants up the other day. ( I honestly did'nt have a belt, it was'nt a fashion statement) But I do see, however, a trend in the mass populas of today's young 20 somethings to be less interested in getting out there. It's true the cookie cutter kids never where the ones to get out there and the ones that have and do, are remarkable.
 
#340 ·
How about we give a young person a chance and a ride? Do you listen to the same music someone 30 years older does ? Do you cook food the same way? You nuke your food in 30 seconds? You have to find common ground or better yet leave the ground behind and go for a sail. Then maybe you can share some food and some tunes. It is all about having a good time. Young or old. I thought ski boats were it. I was shown some real poor hospitality by some old salts and for years would not even come near a sailboat My bad to think all old sailors are crabs. They decided all young folks needed to be treated in a manner they thought best. Smile,Lou
 
#347 · (Edited)
I'm curious on opinions on this one. When Baby boomers were in their 20's there were lots of them in small capable sailboats (some they made themselves) cruising across oceans; but now-a-days the majority of twenty-year olds appear to be utterly useless. I just don't get it, and I'm in my twenties, and cruising.
People mostly rise and attain to match the expectations of those they respect, or of those who have parental charge of them. The parental factor is by far the more important one. Couples both working 60-70 hour weeks, and/or pursuing geechy pleasures during off times and never having any time to serve as a good example and cheerleader allows many a child to lapse into some sort of default lower level.

Several things happened to, or more accurately were done to, the American culture between 1960 and 2000, and little of it was good. Aside from a further emancipation of minorities. Even there the larger culture made space for not an adoption and promulgation of 'white, middle-class, Protestant' values, but of noxious ideas.

I'm also curious as to where people think the future of the sailing industry is going if there are so few young people involved? Any thoughts?
It will revert to being mostly a pursuit of the wealthy. Bespoke vessels, custom-built ones. Perhaps based on modern factory boat patterns, but with much gravy ladled on. Not entirely however, for a well-built fiberglass vessel can last for many decades and thus can serve as a foundation upon which any enterprising person, young or old, may build a dream and even a life.
 
#348 · (Edited)
With a house, people don't really own them, they just pay the bank for the privilege of being able to say they own piece of dirt when they don't. I own my boat 100% and nothing I owe (or ever will owe) will but that in jeopardy. Similarly there is a distinct line between making a boat a home....when you make it yours, put who you are into it. Getting other people to recognize that you actually own it is not as hard as getting people to recognize and accept that you actually live on and will continue to live on it.
As to the future of the sailing industry it is at mercy of the marketing industry, new boats are out of most peoples reach, at one time the industry figured the "average" sailor was a husband, wife and kids who did coastal cruisng on weekends and stayed in marinas, because the housewife controlled the purse strings the interior was designed accordingly, resulting in comfy, easiliy handled though slow boats. Another trick the marketing industry likes to push is put design features from racing boats on cruising boats (if it is on a racing boat it will make my boat go faster right...unless of course it was actually there to fool the handicapping rules) which ended up with boats that took more work than should be found on a cruising boat. The boat industry (just like the car industry) would rather sell a small number of excessively expensive boats, than try and build boats more people can afford....new boats are for people with more money than sense, you can get a much better boat for alot less used.
 
#349 ·
With a house, people don't really own them, they just pay the bank for the privilege of being able to say they own piece of dirt when they don't....
Unless, of course, they DO own them, like I own mine along with the dirt it is built on. No mortgage and a deed that says so. Let's be careful about generalizing. :)
 
#356 ·
wolfenzee: people can own their houses outright or pay a mortgage, just like they can own their boats outright or pay a loan.

I'm 38 which probably doesn't make me count as "young" from the point of view of this thread. However at least half of the friends that I sail with have owned their own boat in their 20s. The ones who own their boats are generally sailing multiple times per month too. A lot of them have well paying jobs, but not all of them do.

There are ways for those who don't have a lot of money to get into sailing, they just don't involve buying their own boats. Students at UW in Seattle can join the sailing club for a very low price and get access to a decent fleet and instruction. Non-students can take sailing classes at CWB and then volunteer to get more free sailing time. Rental here through an outfit like Windworks is a lot cheaper than even moorage if you are only sailing one or two full days per month. I like owning my own boat because I enjoy working on it myself and like being able to take it for long cruises, but if I look at it objectively I see it as a waste of money.

Reading through a few pages of this thread shows all of the worst of sailnet: lots of assumptions, stereotypes, and incorrect information.
 
#360 ·
Had an interesting experience the other night. There were four cruising boats in Mossel Bay (near Cape Agulhas in South Africa which is pretty serious cruising ground) so we decided to get together for a braai (BBQ). Such social affairs are common for cruisers but this one had a big difference, my wife and I were the only ones over 37 and most were around 30 cruising on modest boats, but now most of the way around the world. Someone made the comment that once you got to Cocos Island, ie committed to crossing the Indian Ocean, the proportion of younger cruisers went up substantially. Younger cruisers typically need to get home before the money runs out.

BTW we have seen as many young Swedes cruising as all other countries combined,
 
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#361 ·
What's with the apparent alarm about the "future of sailing" and the lack of interest by young people? It's an interesting discussion, but does it really matter to anyone?

Personally, I wouldn't want to see my local waters any more crowded. The less boats the better. For the boats that are out there, young or old folks, doesn't really matter to me, so long as they're not a bunch of a-holes.
 
#364 · (Edited)
>You should leave the young sailors alone because honestly you have no idea what you are talking about. Everywhere I look there are young families, young women, young men really sailing all over the world and having a lot better time than you are complaining about how the young don't sail because of this or that. This generation of 20 something is the best generation of 20 something I have ever met.<

The relative few who've actually committed to sailing may well be.

Yet mourning the current mass of puffy mall-ites in an obscure forum thread is hardly harassment. Ever watch Leno do one of his Jay-walks and interviewing chance-met folk? Most of those Gens XYZ shouldn't be allowed to operate a wheel-barrow, much less vote.

That was a sensible discussive post, PCP. I did bare-boat for years in some very nice locales before committing to a buy.
 
#368 · (Edited)
The best answer I can think of for this question. It is a big ocean out there and the "young people" can not afford to frequent the fancier/more expensive places and are not seen by the people that can. In addition people of different socioeconomic groups move in different circles. Just because you don't see as many young people cruising doesn't mean they are not, it just means they are not cruising where you are. That said the economy and resulting culture also effects the people who are able to cruise (of all ages). As a poor older sailor....I come across quite a few young cruisers...I also watch the rich "yachties" from a distance
 
#369 ·
Wolfenzee et al.,

Between 1950 and 1990-something, getting jobs, casual or committed, was pretty easy for anyone who didn't need to wear sandals in order to count and who could also read a newspaper story and explain it.

At least it was in North America and Europe. Now things are harsh for young and old, unless they have Paragon Credentials from a Harvard or MIT - plus ten years of specially-relevant experience, which they had somehow attained in just the past five years.

Those circles of affluence and non-affluence have always been there. There always were those 'yacht clubs' to which only the 'select' could be admitted. It's just more the case that the 'tourista effect' has closed so many other doors, and the wealthy have gotten so much more so, and more fearful to boot.
 
#375 ·
Then the thread shouldn't read "why are there so few young people cruising"...but "why are there so few people cruising on shoe string now adays", but the answer to that is self explanatory....there was a fairly extensive thread on Cruiser Forum that addressed that "Cruising on a $500/mo budget"
 
#371 ·
"plan to set sail heading south along the coast from San Diego to Mexico in the summer of 2014. <

Aha. I would recommend bouncing big, after Cabo, down to Mazatlan Bay, and avoiding PV and Acapulco. It's gotten pretty raunchy along that coast. Your mileage may vary.
 
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