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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets
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Topic Review (Newest First)
01-16-2013 10:51 AM
TakeFive
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou452 View Post
One more thought for my life line anchor at work we are told 5000 lbs this is for the average mans weight for 200 lbs as average. I am 180lbs We have seen films in a fall of six foot a 200 pound block can get shock loads of 2-3000 lbs That is why they want the 5000 lbs safety anchor. This jerk might be why knots get so tight or lines snap. I just wish I could tack that fast LOL Regards, Lou
I suspect that there's more to it than that. The 200 lb downward pull on a horizontal lifeline results in a tension that is many times greater than 200 lb. Some simple force vector calculations can show that easily.
01-16-2013 12:51 AM
Lou452
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

One more thought for my life line anchor at work we are told 5000 lbs this is for the average mans weight for 200 lbs as average. I am 180lbs We have seen films in a fall of six foot a 200 pound block can get shock loads of 2-3000 lbs That is why they want the 5000 lbs safety anchor. This jerk might be why knots get so tight or lines snap. I just wish I could tack that fast LOL Regards, Lou
01-15-2013 11:47 AM
knuterikt
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou452 View Post
This might be off topic but does a chart for sail area vs line size strength with wind speed exist? Lets take say the fishing line in the light air and 180 sq ft of sail needs to be what test ? Then with the same sail you will need a -- size line in a 20 knots? You may also need to change your choice of knot on the clew. Regards. Lou
Not a chart but calculators, input some measurements and click Harken
01-15-2013 11:38 AM
peterchech
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou452 View Post
This might be off topic but does a chart for sail area vs line size strength with wind speed exist? Lets take say the fishing line in the light air and 180 sq ft of sail needs to be what test ? Then with the same sail you will need a -- size line in a 20 knots? You may also need to change your choice of knot on the clew. Regards. Lou
Thanks Lou. Whenever I learn something interesting I try to share it online. I've learned so much myself from others who do the same.

Like stumble said, my understanding of jib sheets is that for the most part you are sizing up for ease of handling.

My light air spinnaker sheets are 1/8" vectran core. They have a tensile strength of about 2000# and could certainly handle the loads in heavy air too, but in anything over 15 knots they start cutting through the gloves. 25' boat.

I think of it this way. The winch on my mast is the same size as my primaries. I weigh about 200#, and get winched up the mast fairly often. I see how much effort is needed to get me up the mast with that winch, even though I usually help with my legs, and i can say with confidence that I never put nearly that much strain on my primaries while trimming the sheets, even beating or trimming the guy on a hot angle. So it is unlikely that the sheets have to handle any loads greater than that of my 200# (plus friction so to be safe I say 300#). Obviously you want some room for error, but still this gives a ballpark figure in my mind.

I have winched my 250# father up the mast of his 32' keelboat, and found that on his (larger) primaries, the strain in low gear while winching him up is about equal to the max strain in low gear on the primaries while trimming, so for his 32 footer a minimum working load of say 375# is required, plus a margin of error. So 1/4" sta set polyester double braid, with a tensile strength of 2350#, and a working load for non critical applications of about 460# (tensile strength/5), could theoretically handle the loads. But it would be tough as hell on the hands and there may not be enough room on the winch for the number of turns you would need to make it manageable!

I tend to overestimate loads on my own boat, it helps to be able to put things in perspective.
01-15-2013 09:24 AM
MastUndSchotbruch
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryL View Post
Hey,

Can we all agree that:
1. If you race, or have many different headsails, that two separate sheets are best, and may be tied on with bowlines, or whatever method you like.

2. that if you cruise, and use 1 headsail like 99% of the time, that a single sheet, attached with a cows hitch is pretty easy to so and very effective

3. That there are many different ways of attaching sheets to sails, and the you are able to choose the method that satisfies you and and that said method will not satisfy anyone else.

Barry
I don't agree with (1). Two bowlines on the clew are a great way to get your jib stuck on shrouds, lifelines, whatever, when tacking. I much prefer a single sheet with a soft (Dutch) shackle.
01-15-2013 12:42 AM
BarryL
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Hey,

Can we all agree that:
1. If you race, or have many different headsails, that two separate sheets are best, and may be tied on with bowlines, or whatever method you like.

2. that if you cruise, and use 1 headsail like 99% of the time, that a single sheet, attached with a cows hitch is pretty easy to so and very effective

3. That there are many different ways of attaching sheets to sails, and the you are able to choose the method that satisfies you and and that said method will not satisfy anyone else.

Barry



Quote:
Originally Posted by knuterikt View Post
Maybe because it is kind of awkward to get the sheet free of the sail after use or during a sail change?

Must admit that I prefers a soft shackle to the knot in the OP.
01-14-2013 10:51 PM
Stumble
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Lou,

There are formulas that will tell you sheet loads. I am on my iPhone now or I would post it.

Basically with modern line you size for handling, the stuff is so strong it isn't an issue unless you use tapered sheets
01-14-2013 09:42 PM
Lou452
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

This might be off topic but does a chart for sail area vs line size strength with wind speed exist? Lets take say the fishing line in the light air and 180 sq ft of sail needs to be what test ? Then with the same sail you will need a -- size line in a 20 knots? You may also need to change your choice of knot on the clew. Regards. Lou
01-14-2013 09:30 PM
Lou452
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Peterchech You got a good line going in this thread. Thanks for starting it ! Most of us have seen some good ideas for light and heavy air. Changing sheets under way and how to stay just a little more safe. Thanks to all of you Kind regards, Lou
01-14-2013 02:45 PM
Stumble
Re: Cool, soft way of attaching jib sheets

Lol. I always visualize lifting my car with a piece of 1/8".
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