Democrats versus Republicans

[knothead]

Originally Posted by chucklesR

I think it will be interesting to see where it really goes.
Sure McCain is more like Dubya than Obama, and sure Obama will put the stick it to the rich and redistribute the ill gotten gains etc.. but when it comes down to it,

Who do the majority of voters think is better / has a better plan to run this country?

me, I'd rather have a practical, pragmatic guy that knows enough to say "the economy isn't my strong point" than one who somehow thinks taking money from investors and giving it to welfare moms is going to make the economy better.
I'd rather have a guy who says "we'll do what needs done" than one who has literally flip flopped like a flounder on whether we should be there, should pull out immediately, should phase a withdrawal, or should finish the job (and I'm not saying consistently wrong is better than inconsistent 'cus I don't think doing what needs done is wrong).

I'd rather have a guy that says "my religion is my religion, and not your business" than one who bounces around churches smiling at racist comments and then says "oh, I didn't say that, I just heard it, and I strongly denounce it if doing so will get me more votes"

Change? Sure Oboy got's your change, coming right at you - changing his stance, changing his mind, change from your pocket, change his address, change into a normal politican. Four years of Ob wan later I think we'll be ready for change much like we were after we sent Jimmy back to the peanut farm and brought in Reagan.

There is a reason that since the 70's only 2 presidents have been democratic yet the dem's have always had a higher number of registered voters. It's called common sense.

I would rather have a prez who when faced with a choice, decided to remain in a hell-hole POW camp because his men were not to be released with him than someone who dumps his spiritual advisory because the polls suddenly tell him to.
Speaks to character.

[chucklesR]

Ya'll ever wonder what the real deal is regarding taxes:

If all of their currently stated plans were affected:
MCCAIN OBAMA
Income Avg. tax bill Avg. tax bill
Over $2.9M -$269,364 +$701,885
$603K and up -$45,361 +$115,974
$227K-$603K -$7,871 +$12
$161K-$227K -$4,380 -$2,789
$112K-$161K -$2,614 -$2,204
$66K-$112K -$1,009 -$1,290
$38K-$66K -$319 -$1,042
$19K-$38K -$113 -$892
Under $19K -$19 -$567

Note that both plans have a cost - raising the deficit, McCain's by 4.5 trillion over 4 years, Obama's by 3.3 Trillion over 4 years.

Note also that Obama's plan for what is the majority of folks (the real middle class) isn't all that much different - the real difference is that the over 200k crowd get's to pick up the tab for the rest of the US.
Change.
It's about changing to a welfare state instead of one where everyone pays a fair share.
10% tax for all, no deductions period. It works, it's fair, bring it on. No cost = no ownership in my view.

[sailhog]

Here in the U.S. 1% of the population owns 90% of the nation's wealth. When you're running massive federal deficit, which is driving the value of your currency through the basement floor and inflation through the rough, you need to look at your sources of meaningful revenue would come from. Obviously you're going to go after the folks with the 90% of the nation's wealth and not the 99% of the people who own 10% of the nation's wealth.

South Carolina is the reddest of the red states, and an overwhelming percentage of Republicans here absolutely loathe Bush. McCain will surely win the state, but it's going to be a far more closely run presidential race here than in past years.

[chucklesR]

or, and here's a bright idea -
quit spending more than you make.

call me harsh (I prefer Chuckles) but since when did handouts become the american way? If you don't contribute why should you get?

I'm not saying truly handicapped folks should be left out in the cold, but I'm real tired of paying more in federal taxes than the next 9 families combined pay.
There has to be balance or the system WILL break and folks who make more will find ways to hide it. Count on it.
That's the problem with OB's plan on raising capital gains tax to 28% - people will just not sell when 28% of their gain goes to Billy Bob's trailer court for HUD payments. Instead, they will reinvest and hold for saner tax laws or better times.
Happens every time, and yet reminders are still needed.

[sailhog]

You and I aren't paying for welfare moms... we're paying for my mother-in-law's arthritis medication that costs Medicare $3000/month. The medication is far from a cure. It only makes things "a little better," according to her. And we all know that she ain't the only geezer whose health care we pay for.

[cardiacpaul]

actually, yea, kinda we are paying for geezers... like me.
no, let me re-phrase. Over the 4 years that I've been on the gubbmint dole, my SSDI payments, AND the first two year of medicare (that pays nothing, I have a supplimental plan but I still pay medicare)...
My payments haven't "used up" what I've paid into SSA over my less than stellar 40 yrs of employment. (yes, I had my SS number at age 9, first income year? age 9. ) Nor have they started to touch the portion of what my employers have paid in either. Almost every year of my wage earning career, I bumped up against the max that SSA wanted, so yea, I made a lil sumpin in my day.

Now, fast forward... my savings are gone, kaput, house&pool, cars, bikes, more toys than you could shake a stick at, all gone, 401k's, insurances, retirement plans, you name it, gone like the wind. Feel free to use me as a bad example.

get catastrophic disability health insurance before something happens to you.

I now live on per month, less than I used to take home 10 years ago, per week.

If it wasn't for the hobby I have, and the occasional lap dances I give for tips, I'd be eatin' from the food bank.


Not only are y'all subsidising my med list, Walk into a local ER, count the number of people there.
Using the generally accepted rate, over 80% patients in any 24 hour period there are illegal aliens. (ok, lower in north dakota, a lot higher in Del Rio, Texas) Now figure that the average unpaid and uncollectable bill left by those 80% is a little over 1800.00 (ER Doctor min. charge, 855.00 in florida) and it won't take y'all long to figure out where the money is really goin'.

[sck5]

"So sck5, the party of tolerance and diversity has no room for anyone who doesn't agree with them 100%? "

PB - It was Lieberman who left the party, he wasnt kicked out. He lost the primary and ran under his own party. Now he is backing our opponent. Why on earth would Dems embrace him? Repubs sure wouldnt embrace somebody who openly backed Obama. You have a strange idea of how this all works. Of COURSE dems arent going to embrace everyone you like. Thats because you are a repub and we arent.

[sck5]

hey chuck where are those numbers from? I am not arguing with them - they look reasonable but I am curious who is doing the arithmetic

[sailhog]

It's people like Paul who are the problem. I don't mean to sound too harsh, but if someone could go down there and shoot his ass dead, all of our taxes would go down about 50%. I've run the numbers, and that's what it comes down to, folks. Soooo... the question is.... who's going to do it?

Paul, are you going to be out at that little pub around the corner from your house tonight?

[PBzeer]

sck5 - you seem to have, conveniently forgotten why Joe ran as an Independent. It was because the Dems were dissatisfied with his position on Iraq. So, despite his unwavering support of the rest of the Dem agenda, they went after him. And then there's freezing out former Gov Casey of PA, because he is pro-life.

I do wish though, you'd stick to the substance of my remarks once in a while, instead of always trying to find a GOP 'gottcha' as a means of rebuttal.

Also, though I've said it many times before, I am not a member of the GOP. Could you please try to remember that?