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  #1061 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2008
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But CC debt is unsecured and will not have the same effect as housing deflation.

The comodity market has been a speculators pig trough for many years. That is one of the reasons oil is spiking along with the drop in the dollar. Notice today that when the dollar rose, oil dropped. Hopefully the speculators got burned.
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  #1062 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xort View Post
The comodity market has been a speculators pig trough for many years. That is one of the reasons oil is spiking along with the drop in the dollar. Notice today that when the dollar rose, oil dropped. Hopefully the speculators got burned.
Most of the speculators really got in during the past year or two.

I remember, vividly, years ago, that nobody wanted to have anything to do with gold. Oil, gold, and other commodities were mentioned only briefly in conversations on channels like CNBC and other financial news networks, and then only to talk about how much lower it was going to go. Gold at 270$us/oz was a SCREAMING buy with an obvious bottoming pattern, but it had gone down for so long nobody would even talk about buying it on television save the very rare Monex commercial. That is all good bottoming behavior, when everyone is convinced something can never recover, that the only direction is down, nobody cares about it and everyone has forgotten it even exists as an investment opportunity, when all forces have conspired to destroy it as an investment. And that's what gold bugs used to think, that central banks were in a conspiracy to destroy gold, they talked about it in the same way that people talk about mortgage companies conspiring to rip people off today. But, nothing goes down forever ....

Even when gold started making big gains the folks on the financial channels completely ignored it. They were much more content to move their focus from the crashing Nasdaq over to the thinning NYSE. You still never heard about gold, oil, or anything else except the occasional "congratulations to anyone who owns gold", like that was always some mysteriously brilliant third-party, certainly not part of "us", who are fully invested in the stock market and housing. Besides, how are tv folks going to make a U-turn and start talking about an investment they both haven't owned and have been talking bad on for the past decade ? Admit they are wrong ? Folks just don't do that!

It's really only been in the past year or two that people have gotten on board with the whole idea that the dollar has been going down, and that only since they have been trying to find a goblin to blame for the current dip in the stock market, and loss of price in the housing markets. Now that people are finally talking about gold as an investment, talking about inflation, the dollar losing value, oil going up another 100$us/barrel, 5$us/gallon gas by july, and all of this other junk - now that everyone is convinced it'll only go to the stars and the market really is filled with people who have been buying commodities, yes, that is probably topping activity ... the end is near.
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  #1063 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2008
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I've been quiet for a good time. This same discussion is playing out everywhere it seems. A few observations for those of you who are bought into the market crash zeitgeist :

* When you think others have the heads in the sand, beware - it maybe yours
* When you think the market is manipulated, you may just be right but check from time to time to make sure you're pointing your finger at the right people. While noone disputes the credit crisis is triggered by real issues, it is just as plausible that the markets (and maybe you) are the ones that have been manipulated down. Just take a look at the hedge funds that have coined it recently. Luck?
* Believing you fully understand the macro economic
picture yet being surprised by near term market outcomes is a contradiction. Work it out.

But who cares about my opinions, cos I don't. After all, it's what you do that counts.

Since I last voiced my opinion on this board :
* I doubled my 401k contributions into the stock market.
* I maintained a high proportion of my savings in stock.
* I declared my intention to retire from work
* I reset my expectations and sold my house
* I sold my vacation condo
* I'm buying a rental property
* I prepared a plan B in case I was wrong

In June my wife retires.
In August I retire.
In October we move aboard and begin the dream.
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  #1064 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2008
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Wink As a former Wall Street broker . . .

When everyone is greedy . . . be scared and when everyone is scared be greedy. This is a rule, not an exception.
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Old 05-02-2008
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Quote:
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When everyone is greedy . . . be scared and when everyone is scared be greedy. This is a rule, not an exception.
And if you can get your head around it that sentiment applies to the downside thinking too. There's a been a lot of folks getting greedy trying to get on the tail end of the shorting bandwagon initiated by the big players. I know a few who've already crashed and burned.
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Old 05-02-2008
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The market goes up and down.
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  #1067 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2008
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And that's about the only financial fact I'm close to 100% sure of.
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Old 05-02-2008
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Wind Magic- good post. Sure looks like the stock market is bottoming out, as well as the dollar. Might be a lot of sideways movement for a while which will allow the smart players to accumulate their positions before the public has the nerve to get back in.
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Old 05-02-2008
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I think I'm seeing a lot of sideways movement coupled with an overreactive teenager at the helm of the stock market. "OMG! Sky's falling!" Market goes down. "OMG! Things are better than we thought!" Market goes up. "OMG Sky's falling!".... rinse and repeat.

I have an idea of what stocks to avoid and what stocks to go into... But, still... requires planning. Days of dart throwing are over.
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Old 05-03-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watermelon View Post
I think I'm seeing a lot of sideways movement coupled with an overreactive teenager at the helm of the stock market. "OMG! Sky's falling!" Market goes down. "OMG! Things are better than we thought!" Market goes up. "OMG Sky's falling!".... rinse and repeat.
Is that teenagers at the helm of the stock market or teenagers reporting/commenting on the financial news? I contend it is the latter and it is not something new.
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