Democrats versus Republicans

[sck5]

here they are - not very specific but here is what he has

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/healthcare/

[PBzeer]

No sck5, that wasn't the question either. You made the statement ....

2. To get a sensible health insurance system in this country. EVERY other industrialized country pays way less than we do and has better outcomes. Most or all of the scare mongering from opponents has been debunked (e.g. see above on wait times)

.... after admitting you didn't really know what the plan was. The question was, how did you reach that conclusion, under those circumstances?

I've already seen what little he has to say on the matter, and find no reassurance in it that it won't result in the nationalization of the healthcare system, ie: another entitlement program, when we are already running out of money to fund the one's currently in place.

[sck5]

Oh. I understand what you meant. I have read comparisons of what Obama says vs. what Hillary says, vs. what Edwards said. There were numerous articles in the NY times and other places. What stuck in my mind was the basic similarity between all of their positions which was what my post was about.

So, my sin, if sin there was, was in believing that the NYT got it right. Now that you mention it, maybe I better go take a look at that Obama plan again to make sure the reporter DID get it right. Not guaranteed these days I think.

Here are links to some of it

http://politics.nytimes.com/election...x/issue=health

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2...r-health-care/

But I am not finding the article I had in mind right away. But duty calls right now - I will pick this up again later

[xort]

I keep hearing about the long wait lines in US hospitals vs foriegn. I don't get it. I've seen very short waits for people who need treatment. But I read repeatedly about people in Canada coming over here because of the 6 month wait for routine treatments.
You can bet that gov't managed health care will have plenty of exclusions and restrictions. Much more than now.
I love to hear people rip & tear our govt as incompetent but then advocate the same govt taking over health care.
Just how stupid can one be?

[sck5]

But in answer to your nationalization question - It is certainly fair to say that they are talking about nationalizing health INSURANCE. After all, that is what Medicare is and even if they are offering to allow people to continue with the private plan they already have if they like, offering a Medicare-for-everyone plan IS nationalized health insurance.

But it is NOT nationalized health care like what the Brits have where doctors are govt. employees. Nobody on the Dem side is proposing that. I dont know anybody who wants the system the Brits have - I certainly dont. People point to the Germans as having a plan that works very well, where people live longer, have less wait times, and pay less than we do. They have nationalized INSURANCE but doctors and hospitals are private so far as I know. But I would imagine that we would devise a plan of our own which would hopefully improve on the best examples that are out there.

And now duty really does call. Bye for now

[sck5]

xort

on wait times, check the links in post 1086 in this thread

[PBzeer]

For all to recieve equality of healthcare, there is no option but to nationalize it. And equality is what this is suppose to be all about. Some have, some have not.

As I brought up before (that went unanswered), do you really want the people running the post office to handle your healthcare?

[chucklesR]

Originally Posted by RAGNAR

When the two were equivocated by the systematic attack on the idea that we can know anything with certainty.

Put that in english related to my question please, because the one liner made no sense to me.

[PBzeer]

chuckles - I believe he's saying, that liberal dogma is that there are no absolutes (outside of global warming, Bush is evil, etc)

[chucklesR]

Beezer
But I asked when America became a country of gimme instead of a country of 'I can do that' and that is what he quoted.
That didn't happen in the past 8 years and isn't dogma it's becoming policy.