Democrats versus Republicans

[SailorMitch]

Originally Posted by sck5

Bush reaches levels of popularity even Nixon never got to!!!

And Obama leads McCain by double digits!!

Obama holds 12-point lead over McCain, poll finds - Los Angeles Times

sck5, it's only june. lots of time for polls to change. this is going to be a tight election. don't get excited yet.

[PBzeer]

But Mitch, the groundswell is so large and unstoppable, why bother with actually having an election. After all, Obama has already come up with a new Presidential shield, and judging by the level of Obamamania, we should just coronate him. Not to mention, the way he's spinning it, to not vote for him, or to even question his qualifications, is inherently racist. So we should all just be proper little lemmings and walk right over the cliff for him.

[jrd22]

Knothead- well said. Character is the most important aspect of this election; hopefully the voters will realize that only one candidate has any.

John

[camaraderie]

Originally Posted by sailhog

Here in the U.S. 1% of the population owns 90% of the nation's wealth.

Hawg...I see stuff like that thrown around all the time and it simply is not true. The most recent estimate of household wealth that I could find is this one from the mid 90's, but clearly there has been no massiv transfer in the last decade or so.

ECONOMIC INEQUALITY:
(I'm not sure I trust this data but the NYTimes agrees and who am I to argue with the Times!)


Furthermore...this is wealth that has already been taxed (sometimes more than once...and last time I looked our motto was not "hand over your loot to the poor guys"...but more on the order of "teach a man to fish".
Not likely you say? Well here's some data about the 3.5% of our population that are millionaires from the bowels of the Washington Post:

* Only 19 percent receive any income or wealth of any kind from a trust fund or an estate.
* Fewer than 20 percent inherited 10 percent or more of their wealth.
* More than half never received as much as $1 in inheritance.
* Fewer than 25 percent ever received "an act of kindness" of $10,000 or more from their parents, grandparents, or other relatives.
* Ninety-one percent never received, as a gift, as much as $1 of the ownership of a family business.
* Nearly half never received any college tuition from their parents or other relatives.
* Fewer than 10 percent believe they will ever receive an inheritance in the future.
America continues to hold great prospects for those who wish to accumulate wealth in one generation. In fact, America has always been a land of opportunity for those who believe in the fluid nature of our nation's social system and economy.

washingtonpost.com: The Millionaire Next Door


Somehow we are experiencing a lot more "class envy" and "it is ok to punish the wealthy by making them pay for everything" type thinking in this country. Whatever happened to people being responsible for their own economic well being rather than relying on the success of others to fund what they feel entitled to?

BTW...I come down every bit as hard on the corporate sleazeballs who feather their own nests illegally OR on the backs of their employees. A disturbing trend at BOTH extremes.

[sailhog]

Cam,
All I know is what I read in the papers... and it's your experts against mine!

CNBC's "Untold Wealth: The Rise of the Super Rich" Premiere Moved to June 26th - CNBC News Releases - MSNBC.com

Apparently folks have been getting wealthier in the last few years. The stat I quoted isn't in this story, but it's in their broadcast teaser for the show.

[sailhog]

I should add one thing... my point about the top-heavy structure of the nation's wealth was related to our current debt problems and how they are helping to create inflation. As I understand it, capital gains taxes are at 15%, while earned income tax rates are several points higher. This, to me, would seem to be very poor tax policy. The rates should be the other way around, or at the very least, the same.

As far as class envy goes, I'll admit that I've got as much of it as the next guy. But I'm not calling for class warfare here. I just think that unearned income should be taxed at a greater rate than earned income. This would help curb the national debt. So would massive spending cuts. I'm sure it saddened you, as it did me, that the Republicans couldn't live up to all of their rhetoric of fiscal discpline when they were in control of both houses of congress and the White House from 2004-2006. I have a feeling that this fact alone is causing the dollar to fall a good bit. Those who buy our dollars are not too impressed by the fiscal discipline of the people who bragged about it most. Surely they're thinking that American politicians are willing to lay waste to the American dollar if it will enhance their political careers. You aren't going to find any patriots in Washington.

[PBzeer]

Work hard, save and invest wisely, don't spend foolishly and your reward will be ..... we'll take more of YOUR money, and give it to the people who don't want to do what you did.

[PBzeer]

Hawg - lower capital gains tax rates, results in more economic activity, thereby, increasing tax revenues. Tax rates are not the problem with the debt. SPENDING is the problem.

[sailhog]

Originally Posted by PBzeer

Hawg - lower capital gains tax rates, results in more economic activity, thereby, increasing tax revenues. Tax rates are not the problem with the debt. SPENDING is the problem.

John,
I agree with you to a point. However, as you lower capital gains tax rates, you get diminishing returns on that theory. For instance, if you lowered capital gains to, say, 5%, then I seriously doubt that you would increase tax revenues. On a related point, why not lower the tax rate of earned income? That too would spur economic activity. It's all money, and it's all green.

As far as spending goes... I couldn't agree more.
Respectfully,
Sailhog

[chucklesR]

Originally Posted by sck5

hey chuck where are those numbers from? I am not arguing with them - they look reasonable but I am curious who is doing the arithmetic

Posted from work, forgot to give the link. I forgot the exact search words I used on google but I promise it is a unchanged cut and paste.