Democrats versus Republicans

[SteveInMD]

Well, McCain does a 1.9% chance of winning.

FiveThirtyEight.com: Electoral Projections Done Right

[chucklesR]

Our Constitutional scholar pipes in:
Article II, section three -
Section 3 - State of the Union, Convening Congress

He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient; he may, on extraordinary Occasions, convene both Houses, or either of them, and in Case of Disagreement between them, with Respect to the Time of Adjournment, he may adjourn them to such Time as he shall think proper; he shall receive Ambassadors and other public Ministers; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, and shall Commission all the Officers of the United States.

Somehow you read into that the power of the budget?
Recommending to their consideration means he writes the budget?

You really have accountability issues don't you?

Try Article I, section 7
Section 7 - Revenue Bills, Legislative Process, Presidential Veto

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Every Bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a Law, be presented to the President of the United States; If he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his Objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the Objections at large on their Journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such Reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the Bill, it shall be sent, together with the Objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a Law. But in all such Cases the Votes of both Houses shall be determined by Yeas and Nays, and the Names of the Persons voting for and against the Bill shall be entered on the Journal of each House respectively. If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten Days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the Same shall be a Law, in like Manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their Adjournment prevent its Return, in which Case it shall not be a Law.

Followed, in part by section 8

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow money on the credit of the United States;

You tell me where the power is. As in all things follow the money.

The president can't even pick what brand of TP he uses without congress concurring.

Signing statements are statements, with no power other than to express an opinion that carries forward as history with the law.

[sck5]

Chuckles

So I was hallucinating in all those years when the President proposed a budget? Sure, Congress debates, changes and then passes it, but the Prez does indeed propose programs, spending priorities, etc. And then he does the STate of the Union speech to advertise and convince that his priorities are the right ones.

It is just plain wrong to say that the Prez merely executes what the Congress comes up with. The Prez has a far more important role than that.

[sck5]

Google "president's budget" and the first link to come up is this:

Budget FY 2009 - The Budget Documents

It is the office of managment and budget (OMB) and THEY certainly think the President is the one who proposes the budget - on that page you can find this:

Budget of the United States Government, Fiscal Year 2009 contains the Budget Message of the President, information on the President’s budget and management priorities, and budget overviews organized by agency.

Yes, of course congress debates and modifies but the president proposes in the first place. His proposal is the starting point for the discussion. That is power, as is the need to get the Presidential signature to make it happen.

[chucklesR]

SCK,
If you read one tenth of what I post you'd know I already said that.
The president proposes a budget, then congress changes it, in our case adding a bunch of new programs etc..

In no case in recent history has the budget passed back to the president been smaller than that proposed. That's one of the reasons that most republicans here on sailnet are pissed at their own party, they violated their promises too.

Imagine you go shopping for a nice new boat with that welfare check you got (sorry,the economic stimulus check) - you want to spend 10k, your wife says no, really, you can spend 15k.

Now, you tell me who has the power?

Who has the accountability for the 15k price tag?

Logic time, think instead of reacting anti-bush.

[sck5]

"think instead of reacting anti-bush"

now chuck. really. the budget process is what it is, regardless of who is prez. And as far as that goes we have had all possible combinations of parties in power in the presidency, with and without control of congress over the past 20 years. It isnt partisan to say what the system is and how it works. You really need to watch your knee jerk partisan tendencies

[sck5]

and as for that boat, my wife has been egging me on for a year to go get one so she can watch palm trees waving around from the cockpit. She has been full speed ahead and I dont know what her financial limit was except that it was more than mine. I am a lucky man.

[Drifter2869]

Well after today you guys can take up a new hobby besides fighting over all this, hey mybe take up some sailing.

[PBzeer]

The President may PROPOSE, only Congress can DISPOSE. It's that's simple.

It's kinda like saying we shouldn't do what Hoover did, when not actually knowing what he did, which was spend, spend, spend. Since that's what you want.

[TropicCat]

Originally Posted by Drifter2869

Well after today you guys can take up a new hobby besides fighting over all this, hey mybe take up some sailing.

I don't think so. Conservatives use this thread to tell us how McCain is going to win the election. Beginning tomorrow, they will use this thread to complain about the Obama administration.

They won't ever stop pontificating.