Democrats versus Republicans

[PBzeer]

The intellectual disconnect of the American voter has never been more apparent than it has this cycle.

[cardiacpaul]

"I'm proud of the fact that I stood up early and unequivocally in opposition to Bush's foreign policy (and was the only U.S. Senate candidate in Illinois to do so). That opposition hasn't changed." (June 19, 2003)

Pretty tough talk coming from a first term STATE Legislator.
(one that voted "present" 130 times.)

"That opposition hasn't changed."

nope, guess not..
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar..._iraq_funding/

oops, somebody actually watches how he votes, then calls him on it, guess he'd better fall in line with Hillary...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18862112/

Obama did not give a floor speech against the war until June 2006. He did, however, introduce legislation a year ago — around the same time he opened an exploratory committee for a presidential bid — that called for U.S. troops to be withdrawn from Iraq by next April.

how con-vien-iant.

[chucklesR]

It's easy to throw rocks and rotting vegetables when you are on the outside and trying to gain votes; simple history shows that very few have not changed spots entirely once they put their belly to the buffet that is the american tax payer.

Does anyone have any examples of politicians (from either side of the aisle) that remained true to their stated pre-election hyberbole?

I think it's a combination of 'might as well get me some of that'; 'dude, I expect a return on my investment' from campaign bribers (donors), and total resignation once a candidate gets his feet in the door and sees how the american political system really works - not that I know.
All that combined, weighs too much on their souls, changes them forever.

I'm not sure about some of them, have never considered myself republican or democrat - but you have to ask yourself - why are these people REALLY running for office, which one do you believe is doing it because they think that only they can fix the problems and put america back on track?????

When you have the answer to that,
go out and campaign against the meglomaniacal, tin hat wearing do gooder and elect an honest to pete graft taking criminal. After all, it's best to keep the bad guys squarely in front of you so you know where they are and you can keep an eye on them.
What? did you think you were going to vote for someone with vision and promise and thereby change the system???


This the election may come down to how many Democrats scared or repulsed by the Clinton's and afraid or too racist to elect a black vote for McCain instead. Or if conservatives will stay home on election day just to prove how pure they are by not giving McCain their stamp of approval.

[PBzeer]

Chuckles - the only one I know of is Sen Tom Coburn of OK. Plus there are a few representatives that haven't ever requested any earmarks, and I think, Sen Mitch McConnell is in that club as well.

Personally, I'd like to see them do away with Rep and Dem, and just go by what they are, either conservative, moderate (which is as useless as tits on a boar hog), or liberal.

[camaraderie]

Thought this would be of interest. I went to the tax tables link and it appears to be true in terms of who will pay more but off a bit on the math. Can anyone refute this/ add anything?

Subject: Taxes - Clinton vs Bush years

Based on using the actual tax tables (see link below), here are some
examples on what the taxes were/are on various amounts of income for both
singles and married couples. so let's see if the Bush tax cuts only
helped the rich. http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/151.html

Taxes under Clinton 1999 Taxes under Bush 2008

Single making 30K - tax $8,400 Single making 30K - tax $4,500

Single making 50K - tax $14,000 Single making 50K - tax $12,500

Single making 75K - tax $23,250 Single making 75K - tax $18,750

Married making 60K - tax $16,800 Married making 60K- tax $9,000

Married making 75K - tax $21,000 Married making 75K - tax $18,750

Married making 125K - tax $38,750 Married making 125K - tax $31,250

If you want to know just how effective the mainstream media is, it is
amazing how many people that fall into the categories above think Bush
is screwing them and Bill Clinton was the greatest President ever. If
any democrat is elected, ALL of them say they will repeal the Bush tax cuts and a good portion of the people that fall into the categories above can't wait for it to happen.

EDIT: I figured out the problem. What the poster did is take the top MARGINAL tax rate for each income level and apply it to ALL income to make the comparison...instead of applying the right % of taxation to each LEVEL of their income. For example...if you do the math correctly...a married couple making $75k under Clinton would pay $15390 vs. $11438.
Still...the point that everyone WHO PAYS TAXES benefits from Bush's tax cuts is real...but anyone with a half a brain knows how the tax tables work and I'm sure whoever originally posted this comparison was simply creating a plausible lie to forward their agenda. I'd prefer only Democrats do the lying!

[erps]

Good illustration!

[sck5]

Just a note - If congress does nothing then the tax cuts will expire all by themselves - this was written into the original tax cut bills when they were passed. Actually it is probably likely that this will happen since the govt. is running large deficits and the politically easiest thing to do is simply sit back, do nothing, let the cuts expire and claim that somebody else did it (which would be true in this case since it was in the original bill)

[PBzeer]

Since tax revenues have risen since the tax cuts, only a liberal could explain how elimanting the cuts would raise more money, past the first year.

[chucklesR]

All I know is I want the AMT lowered and the law rewritten so everyone has to pay - at a minimum - 5% of their real, before deductions, non-earned credit (and again, wtf is a earned credit as applied to tax?) income; I don't care how much or how little someone made - everyone should have a REAL payment to make every frigging year to give them an honest to god stake in america.
Talk about 'no free lunch' - I don't have the numbers but seems to me that a damn awful lot of american's pay no NET taxes to uncle sam per year, and those same free feeders at the trough are the ones bitching about Uncle Sammy not doing enough to help them.
There's no free lunch, hell it's a all you can eat buffet, open 24 hours, 365.25 days a year.

Here's a idea - on election day you bring your tax form print out; if the bottom line says you paid no taxes, you can't vote.

I like that one. Let's do it.

[RAGNAR]

nnn