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[bwalker42]

Originally Posted by aeventyr60

The oath accomplishes NOTHING. Just a bunch hot air.

Thank you for your perspective.
Mine looks like this. A bunch of guys get together who took the oath.
They look at each other and discuss that oath with their God, their families, and their country men at the forefront of their minds.
They are men of Honor, Comittment, Faith, Truth, Love, Compassion, Family, And they believe with all of their hearts, that their lives are to defend that Constitution. And They do with all their hearts. The Army, Navy, Airforce, Marines, Coast Guard. They are are families. Our Children we have born. Our brother's sister's father's mother's etc... They have their Nation at the forefront of their perspective. And they are protective of their Land. And I love them for that. (here a red beating heart would be apropriate)
They are no different than anyone else standing up for what they believe. They are making a stand. I applaud and love them for that.

So when they are used as pawns unnecessarily, I get concerned.
When the suicide rate is off the charts for our military and veterans, I'm not a happy camper, At all. And it makes me think, Hey, what's wrong with this picture? This is something that should not be. And I wanna fix it.

[SloopJonB]

Originally Posted by bwalker42

They are men of Honor, Comittment, Faith, Truth, Love, Compassion, Family, And they believe with all of their hearts, that their lives are to defend that Constitution. And They do with all their hearts. The Army, Navy, Airforce, Marines, Coast Guard.

And police and firefighters and so on. All very appropriate that they take an oath when they sign up. Where I have a problem is when they are no longer serving (or never did) and they make a ritual of "keeping" that oath. That is when it becomes a concern because it has then entered the realm of secret handshakes and other such clubby, fanatical practices.

Originally Posted by bwalker42

So when they are used as pawns unnecessarily, I get concerned.
When the suicide rate is off the charts for our military and veterans, I'm not a happy camper, At all. And it makes me think, Hey, what's wrong with this picture? This is something that should not be. And I wanna fix it.

Not sure what your "pawns" comment is about but ALL veterans should be treated with the honour and respect they have earned at the risk of their lives. Taking proper care of them, be it education, job training, medical care or whatever is the DUTY of those they protected with their lives. If ever anything deserved to be a "cost is no object" program, that is it. It is more than altruistic as well, look at the effect the G.I. Bill had on your society after WWII.

[aeventyr60]

All my due respects to the military folks. However, another oath? Surely it is against the UCMJ to disobey an "order"?

I wholeheartedly agree that we are not taking care of our veterans. The suicide rate is appalling, and is of great concern to the military leadership. But with the Government demanding repeated tours of duty in our never ending conflicts, this is the result. So how about ending the wars? For patriots everywhere....

[bwalker42]

Originally Posted by aeventyr60

All my due respects to the military folks. However, another oath? Surely it is against the UCMJ to disobey an "order"?

I wholeheartedly agree that we are not taking care of our veterans. The suicide rate is appalling, and is of great concern to the military leadership. But with the Government demanding repeated tours of duty in our never ending conflicts, this is the result. So how about ending the wars? For patriots everywhere....

I agree, but am not aware of any "other" oath. I'm talking about The origional oath, the oath keepers keep. What's wrong with that??

[bwalker42]

Originally Posted by SloopJonB

And police and firefighters and so on. All very appropriate that they take an oath when they sign up. Where I have a problem is when they are no longer serving (or never did) and they make a ritual of "keeping" that oath. That is when it becomes a concern because it has then entered the realm of secret handshakes and other such clubby, fanatical practices.



Not sure what your "pawns" comment is about but ALL veterans should be treated with the honour and respect they have earned at the risk of their lives. Taking proper care of them, be it education, job training, medical care or whatever is the DUTY of those they protected with their lives. If ever anything deserved to be a "cost is no object" program, that is it. It is more than altruistic as well, look at the effect the G.I. Bill had on your society after WWII.

Well stated SJ,
tbc... Bon nuit.

[mdbee]

There is a difference between a lawful and an unlawful order.

Remember Nuremberg?

A soldier can be court martialed for not following an order but his defense can be that it was an unlawful order.

Originally Posted by aeventyr60

All my due respects to the military folks. However, another oath? Surely it is against the UCMJ to disobey an "order"?

I wholeheartedly agree that we are not taking care of our veterans. The suicide rate is appalling, and is of great concern to the military leadership. But with the Government demanding repeated tours of duty in our never ending conflicts, this is the result. So how about ending the wars? For patriots everywhere....