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Autopilot while racing

12K views 18 replies 9 participants last post by  puddinlegs 
#1 ·
I've seen sailing instructions that make special note that single or doublehanded divisions are allowed to use autopilot. The implication is that fully crewed divisions are not. When I ask around at a yacht club people tell me that the general racing rules of sailing (ISAF RRS) prohibit the use of autopilot.

That would be fine, but when I look up the RRS at sailing.org in the study version, the regular version, amendments to the RRS, or the equipment rules, I can find no reference to autopilot, autohelm, or electric steering. No document seems to mention it anywhere. The only reference at all to steering is rule 42.2 and 42.3.

If there really is a rule against autopilot use, where the heck is it?

GTJ
 
#2 ·
Perhaps it is a case of "in this class, you're allowed 5 members on board". The AP sets one person free to do other functions and that seems to be in contradiction of the class rules. For example the rules in the AC are very clear and an AP would clearly breach them.

On the other end, the Vendee Globe has AP as an almost mandatory piece of kit.

That said, I am speculating and don't actually know the answer.
 
#3 ·
Generally speaking rule 52 is in play:

52 MANUAL POWER
A boat's standing rigging, running rigging, spars and movable hull
appendages shall be adjusted and operated only by the power
provided by the crew.


But local sailing instructions can override this rule... and usually do especially in Single-hand and Double-hand, mostly for safety reasons. Symmetrical spinnaker launches under decent wind get entertaining (pronounced dangerous) without the artificial electric hands when sailing short handed. Ask me how I know, yikes.
 
#5 ·
Generally speaking rule 52 is in play:

52 MANUAL POWER
A boat's standing rigging, running rigging, spars and movable hull
appendages shall be adjusted and operated only by the power
provided by the crew.
Any engineer can tell you there is a very clear distinction between power and control. Power is measured in Watts and is the basis of real work. Control is simply information. The important part of an autopilot is control, not power.

Since hydraulic backstay adjustments are clearly allowed by rule 52 so long as they are hand pumped hydraulics, so should any other hydraulic adjustment as long as it powered by a human instead of powered by some other source. It seems a rather trivial matter to replace an electric hydraulic pump with a hand hydraulic pump and an accumulator to store up hydraulic pressure to run the helm, with the valves controlled by an autopilot. Such a system would clearly be operated by the power of the crew and should have no conflict with rule 52.

If rule 52 said "operated by the crew" it would be a different matter, but since it says "powered by the crew", there should be no complaint.
 
#9 ·
My experience (very limited) is to be upfront with your RC, and the club that is hosting it.

Ask them flat out if it's permitted... We DID ask about auto-pilots no? Not hydraulic backstays.

Heck it was a shocker to me that some clubs/rules are against electric winches (not that I have such niceties). Again, I assume if you are racing PHRF and you were upfront, I doubt they'd have you remove your winches just to race.

Oh and if you are crazy enough to solo sail, and get permission to use your autopilot... keep the symmetrical spinnaker launches for ONLY during light wind (less than 10knts). It can become a circus quickly. In 12-15 wild fun (danger) happens.
 
#14 · (Edited)
This is too funny… If “drunken little Otto” is the best helmsman on your boat than perhaps racing isn’t your thing. When we get bored doing a delivery we will sometimes hold contests to see who can drive the boat the fastest. So far,” little Otto” has never finished above DFL.

The key word is “operated” of which covers the use of an electronic autopilot. Neither arcane or arbitrary, this rule (as it applies to autohelms) is a safety issue. An unattended helm is a pretty dangerous thing and in crossing situations or the general close quarters in sailboat racing, don’t you want a human hand on the tiller? Besides, isn't that where the fun is?

GPS’s, like sextants are wholly contained on the boat. If you ban one, why not the other? The rule of not receiving outside support is a valid one. How would you feel if your competitors were receiving outside instruction or coaching via the radio or internet connection. On ocean races, the SIs will indicate what you can download (things like GRIB files).
 
#15 · (Edited)
This is too funny… If "drunken little Otto" is the best helmsman on your boat than perhaps racing isn't your thing. When we get bored doing a delivery we will sometimes hold contests to see who can drive the boat the fastest. So far," little Otto" has never finished above DFL.
^^^^This.

Helming a boat in a long race is a very sensory-based, 3-dimensional activity. It requires anticipation of a lot of variables, not just reaction to them. Otto just ain't got it when it comes to this kind of driving.

So in this regard, it would make absolutely no sense to want to use the AP when you're racing.

To your point however, SJack, this situation will most likely be encountered in Off-Shore races, not in-shore stuff. In that regard, the ORR has this to say about it (which leverages somewhat your definition of power/energy vs. control)

4.09 Energy Storage.
Other than bilge pumps, no device, unless permitted under RRS 52 Manual Power, may be used while racing which derives assistance from energy stored to do work. However, refer to the ORR Appendix 7 exclusion to this for yachts rated with water ballast or canting keel. This rule may be modified by race organizers through their Notice of Race to permit the use of stored energy for winches, furlers and autopilots.
It's generally left to the RO to make these calls.
 
#16 ·
I don't think the decline of racing sailing can be blamed on not allowing autopilots.

There is no way an autopilot is going to out perform even a moderately skillful helmsman in terms of performance, and I'd even prefer a crappy helmsman that was keeping a look out since they are at least likely to avoid hitting something while an autopilot would blithely steer where ever it was last pointed (unless it began roaming as mine often does).

In short handed and distance racing I think RC's would be wise to amend the rules to allow autopilots but for races less than a a few hundred miles on a fully crewed boat I don't see a need to allow them.
 
#18 ·
For the record, I never suggested OTTO was a better helmsman... but I DID ask myself to use such when I was sailing inland single-handed. I wanted to be able to launch my symmetrical spinnaker myself... and OTTO made that quite interesting (best bet is do it as close to DDW as possible, OTTO gets too much weather helm and he gets all punchy)...

Most racing rules are pretty specific against their use, but as said several times above, local RC rules can override this... for electric winches, OTTO, or hydraulic backstays and also apparently lifting foils...

Methinks this has dissolved into sour grapes.

Rule 52, if you want to use OTTO, please contact your RC before you race, who knows you might get the green light (instead of the red protest flag).
 
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