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  #121  
Old 02-12-2010
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Timebandit
Boat is competing against others by PHRF, sailing skill is a variable including selecting optimal wind and tide/current, course is fixed by three marks.

Repeat as many times as you want, until you have wrung the best possible time from the course, your boat and your skills.

The competition is sailing skills, and the potential benifit is to learn from others.
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  #122  
Old 02-13-2010
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That is what I call pratice or bench racing.

Racing is a dynamic thing. You get one chance to put it alltogether with no do overs.

I agree that sailing has a lot of variables But there are a couple that you are leaving out.

Lots of other boats that you have to dodge on the start.

Boats the blanket your air.

Boats that pinch you at the mark.

Boats that cause you to change your tack because you are the burdended boat.

Things that break or become tangled or ripped.

Sailing in dirty air.

Personally I think PHRF racing is just racing aginst yourself.

If you are going to handicap the race then let the slower boats start with their handicap first so that the finish will be exciting, first boat over the finish line wins.

Just imagine a finish that might have 99% of the racers at the finish line at the same time and no big bunch up at the start.

Even if you start in the middle you will still be at the finish line with all the other boats trying to get that last bit of speed to cross the line first.

The slower boats would get a chance to see the faster boats sail as they near the finish line instead of watching them sail away only to be seen again at the dock.

As a racers what is more fun that passing other racers?

The world cruisers in their fat assed boat blowing on their sails as that 100 ft. tri Americas Cup boat is comming up fast, now that would be a sight to see.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulladh View Post
Timebandit
Boat is competing against others by PHRF, sailing skill is a variable including selecting optimal wind and tide/current, course is fixed by three marks.

Repeat as many times as you want, until you have wrung the best possible time from the course, your boat and your skills.

The competition is sailing skills, and the potential benifit is to learn from others.
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Last edited by timebandit; 02-13-2010 at 11:17 AM.
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  #123  
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What you are describing is more interesting and challenging competition, but the Global Regatta is a simpler concept that requires minimal organization at a local level and very few entry requirements. Just you, your, boat and your course.
Why not hold the competition you describe on a Global Regatta course, and post the results.

Last edited by Ulladh; 02-13-2010 at 11:37 AM.
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  #124  
Old 02-15-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulladh View Post
Timebandit
What you are describing is more interesting and challenging competition, but the Global Regatta is a simpler concept that requires minimal organization at a local level and very few entry requirements. Just you, your, boat and your course.
Why not hold the competition you describe on a Global Regatta course, and post the results.
You nailed it Ulla.

Time, he's right about holding your competition on a GR course of your choosing. It would be great to see a group of boats racing together around an "invisible" course. Heck - some of them might even to choose to race in one direction while the others choose the opposite (like the TBF race).

Another cool aspect to this is boat traffic. Because there is no physically marked course, you have to deal with whatever is "on that course" during the race.

The more we talk about it, the more it becomes evident that this type of race will test just about every sailing skill there is (chart reading, GPS navigation, rules of the road, tides, currents, wind and sea conditions, you name it). Pretty cool if you ask me.
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  #125  
Old 02-15-2010
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Okay, so now that we've pretty much settled the "sign up" info including the yacht divisions, let's figure out what info each racer will need to provide for each race.

First, here's what we'll already have from the racer's account:

1. Yacht Name
2. Yacht Brand
3. Yacht Division (PHRF range)
4. Hull/Sail Number
5. Racing Area (New York, Philadelphia, Denmark, Syndey, whatever)

Here's the additional info I'm thinking we'll need for each race submission:

1. Date and time of race
2. GR course (from a pull down on the site)
3. Overall time (which will be confirmed by the GPX/KML)
4. GPX/KML file (Either from a hosted location tied to your GPS service or emailed to us. We'll look into a direct upload of the file into our database as well.)
5. Wind speed during race (prevailing and max)
6. Sea state during your race (waves, current, etc.)
7. Comments (any additional info you want to reveal about the race)

Does this give us enough info for equitable standings? What else needs to be there?

From here, guys could drill down amongst each other for specific PHRF ratings, sail configurations, mods, etc. of the winning boats. It's not all necessarily listed in the above info (which is intended to be general and easily understood) - but it's there for people to fight over if they want.

Also, with the above info, I think we'd have enough to generally compare times from course-to-course based on conditions.

Let me know what you guys think.
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  #126  
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Does this work for my 10nm course.

A 38.514361 - 76.291147
B 38.501362 - 76.242645
c 38.521256 - 76.235480
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  #127  
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I'll put it in lap - and we'll see what we get.
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  #128  
Old 02-16-2010
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Only thing I would add, in comments a suggestion to give a report including photgraphs, short video and short narrative, which could be a link to the sailors blog or website.
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  #129  
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Great idea Ulla. Done.
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  #130  
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How to lay out your course:

The easiest way to do this is use Google Earth (you can also use Google Maps - but it's not as straight forward). Here are the steps:

1. Open Google Earth.
2. Zoom to your area.
3. Click on the "Ruler" icon at the top of the page.
4. Select "Path" - and make sure your units are set to "Nautical Miles".
5. Create a triangle for the course you are designing. You'll actually need to put in 4 points as the endpoints of the triangle can't connect. Just get them close.
6. Look at the overall length of the course - and start moving the marks around as needed to get the 5 nm or 10 nm course.
7. Make sure your course is as safe as it can be (traffic, water depth, currents, etc.).
8. Once the course is nailed down, go under "Preferences" (top pull-down menu) and make sure the Lat/Long units are set to "Decimal Degrees".
9. Zoom into each mark, hover your cursor over the mark and write down the Lat/Long coords for that mark.
10. Let me know what those coords are, which city your course is closest to, which body of water it's on, and I'll get it into the GR database.
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