racing situation that happened to me yesterday

[zz4gta]

Originally Posted by bobbylockes

I think the conclusion that can be drawn from this is that I was at fault in the zone and therefore had to make a penalty turn. Yet the biggest fault was before the zone when I didn't yell protest and innocently stretch my arm skywards and hit the competitors boom. Had this been done the competitor would've either taken a penalty turn ( in which case the situation in the zone would never have happened as he would've been left behind ) or he would've carried on sailing, got disqualified and I would've been exempt from making a penalty turn after the incident in the zone because he was already in the wrong and forced me to make an error.

I think the racing rules should make things clearer regarding dangerous sailing, there should be no room for interpretation when it comes to the risk of injury to people. It doesn't get much more dangerous in dinghy sailing than having a boom moving about just above your head.

I agree on both accounts. Gotta get sorted out before the 3 length zone. And the rules work, but they aren't the safest. Unfortunately it's really hard to define the "gray area" or what is a "safe distance".

[GeorgeB]

Bobby – So what was the finding in the protest room? Perhaps I’m not following the scenario completely (can you diagram this?). But, it seems to me that the other guy had already established inside overlap on you before the mark. After-all when you trying to lift him up, how else could his boom find its way over your rail? If that is the case, then wouldn’t you be obligated maintain a proper course?

[zz4gta]

I was under the impression that the only time you need to sail your proper course is when you overtake someone from astern. You cannot overtake someone, and then luff them up. Otherwise, you can sail where ever you'd like.

[GeorgeB]

This is the part that is confusing to me. I thought that “bobby” was getting overtaken to windward and was attempting to peal his competitor off at the leeward mark? If that was the case, wasn’t he obligated to maintain his proper course to the mark?

[nolatom]

Yeah, under Rule 17, you can't sail above proper course unless the overlap began either by windward overtaking you, or by boats more than 2 lengths apart laterally becoming overlapped thereafter.

But if the rule-meister who likes to "test' others out on the water didn't screamingly point out the above at the time, I'd guess leeward had a proper "defensive" overlap and was entitled to luff (and no more "mast abeam" to curttail it, either, so you can take him to Mars).

The problem, as all realize, was later at the mark-overlap zone.

[bobbylockes]

The proper course rule doesn't apply to my boat in the situation I described because I was on the lead boat and was clear before he blanketted our wind and began trying to pass me to windward. I could've luffed up until my jib started flapping if I wanted to, he would've had to luff up with me. and he respected that, albeit his interpretation of "keeping clear" is counted in cm's of his boom above my head.

The proper course rule exists to prevent boats coming from behind , obtained an overlap to leewar within 2 boat lengths) of the lead boat and forcing that lead boat to luff up. Proper course is a very good rule but it is very badly described in the racing rules and consequently gets badly abused on the water. The lead boat can always defend his position by luffing up provided he was indeed the lead boat. The lead boat generally does not want to start a luffing match as its usually the start of a lose-lose situation. I decided to luff to test the tester. I was too curious.

I wish I could draw a diagram and post it but unfortunately I can't.

For the sake of interest, there is an important exception to proper course rule. The proper course rule does not apply to the leeward boat if the leeward boat luffed up more than 2 boat lengths away from the lead boat. Imagine you have 2 boats, one is sailing directly toward the leeward mark and the other boat decided to jibe its way to the leeward mark. The jiber would ALWAYS have priority over the boat that is sailing directly to the windward mark (EXCEPT when the boat sailing directly to the mark is on starboard tack and the boat jibing is on port-tack).

that means this situation can occur:

If a boat sailing directly towards the mark (mr 'as-the-crow-flies') is on starboard tack and the other boat "Mr Jiber" jibes on to starboard tack within the 2 boat length zone of Mr Crow, then Mr Jiber actually has luffing rights over Mr Crow' even though he was within the 2 boat length zone. mr jiber was always sailing his proper course to the leeward mark so mr crow has to unfortunately start luffing up. I think this aspect of the rule is potentially dangerous to be honest and wouldn''t be suprised if its addressed in the next edition of the racing rules.


Generally the proper course rule is very good and very necessary when many different classes of boat sail the same course. I recall a situation a while a go when a guy on a boat flying a spinnaker yelled at us to sail our proper course (ie lower than he was sailing) when we were flying a gennaker and therefore inherently sailing higher than his boat and jibing more often to reach the leeward mark.


Back to my situation on the friday night, the jury boat didnt know the rules they said I should do a penalty turn because I hadn't been sailing my proper course.... (we are a social sailing club after all!!)...

[bobbylockes]

Keep Clear One boat keeps clear of another if the other can sail her course
with no need to take avoiding action and, when the boats are overlapped on
the same tack, if the leeward boat can change course in both directions
without immediately making contact with the windward boat