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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2008
johnshasteen johnshasteen is offline
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To add a touch of hard dollar reality to this thread - the last time Paloma (a second-generation Bristol with cutaway forefoot and skeg-hung rudder) was out of the water for her tri-annual bottom job, the majority of the boats (over 20 boats - some as big as 40 feet) out of the water for repairs were spade rudder boats with rudder problems. I talked with a number of those owners (many who came over to go gaga over the strong underbody of Paloma) and most said they would never own a spade rudder boat again. Several of them had run aground and damaged the rudder getting unstuck.
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2008
Rockter Rockter is offline
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It's long keel for me every time.
Spade rudders for those that like them.
I do not.
A long keel really cannot hang on anything, this side of sanity.
The weight penalty is certainly something to consider with a long keel, and the extra wetted area does not help much in the light airs, but you wait for the big seas.... it's different then.
A spade rudder in a big sea?
Not for me.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2008
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Johnshasheen, your comments are interesting in that they run counter to what I found here on the Chesapeake Bay where running aground is an artform. As I said earlier in this thread, "I asked a number of boat yard managers how frequently they see damaged rudders and bent rudder posts here on the Chesapeake Bay. It was an interesting discussion, which suggested that they saw as many as one or two damaged rudders each year depending on the size of the yard.

The discussion was interesting. They indicated that the incidence of damaged rudders is more related to the popularity of boats with shoal draft and rudders that have a nearly the same depth as their keels. They did not think that it made much of a difference whether the boat had a rudder that was hung off the keel, skeg hung or post-hung. In fact they seemed to agree that prior to the trend in shoal draft post hung rudders that are nearly equal in depth to the keel (like Island Packets for example) the majority of damaged rudders were keel hung rudders since they tended to be closer in depth to the keel than either skeg hung or post hung rudders would have been until sometime in the mid 1990's."


Jeff


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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2008
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Damn....I gotta get rid of my boat...not only is the keel a bad design....so is the rudder....



what was I thinking......
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2008
sailaway21 sailaway21 is offline
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Old 03-27-2008
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"what was I thinking...."

Fat girls need lovin' too. (?)

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would you not like to have this "fat" baby???? C'mon tell the truth....



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  #87 (permalink)  
Old 03-28-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_H View Post
It was an interesting discussion, which suggested that they saw as many as one or two damaged rudders each year depending on the size of the yard.

The discussion was interesting. They indicated that the incidence of damaged rudders is more related to the popularity of boats with shoal draft and rudders that have a nearly the same depth as their keels. They did not think that it made much of a difference whether the boat had a rudder that was hung off the keel, skeg hung or post-hung. In fact they seemed to agree that prior to the trend in shoal draft post hung rudders that are nearly equal in depth to the keel (like Island Packets for example) the majority of damaged rudders were keel hung rudders since they tended to be closer in depth to the keel than either skeg hung or post hung rudders would have been until sometime in the mid 1990's.
Jeff, you are using soft language here. They "seemed" to agree....
It just makes sense that an exposed rudder is more easily damaged than one that is protected by the keel. It also makes sense that a rudder that is supported at many places throughout its length is stronger than one that isn't. Think logs and other flotsam that your boat may hit, not just the ground. The keel hung rudder is a far safer bet. I personally know first hand of several rudder stories involving logs, all spade (post hung) rudders (some on power boats) and few ended well. I don't know of any bad stories involving the older style skeg and keel hung rudders (although I am sure some exist). I would think that the only way to really damage a keel hung rudder is to hit something going backwards......
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Old 03-28-2008
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would you not like to have this "fat" baby???? C'mon tell the truth....
Alex...she hardly takes up 1/2 the conpanionway...she is going to be mad at you calling her a "fat baby".
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Old 04-01-2008
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glad you said it and not me...
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