Hoyt Balanced Rig

[JohnRPollard]

Originally Posted by TrueBlue

As Jeff noted, how does this boat behave in moderate to high winds, even when reefed? I would expect some serious heeling issues.

Any of the traditional lug rigs I've sailed have impressed me with their ability to stand up to a lot of wind without inducing much heel. I believe the center of effort is much lower in the sail than on a triangular sail, and as the breeze builds they tend by the very nature of their design to twist and spill air.

However, my experience with them is limited to dinghies/daysailers, and I'm not sure I'd want to rig a big boat this way.

[Jeff_H]

I don't think that the "non-traditional look" will kill this rig as at one point in history Gaff and marconi rigs were non traditional, and nothing is less traditional than the Lateen rig which of course was used on the the largest production number boat in history (the sunfish).

As I look at this rig it probably is a great reaching rig in that it probably develops a lot of power reaching with comparatively little heeling, but my sense is that John Pollard is somewhat correct that in many ways this will behave like a lug rig, which in my experience requires a lot more sail area for a given amount of drive and at least in my experience heels more going to weather than you would expect given the low aspect ration as compared to other low aspect rigs like a gaff rig, and which is prone to excitation rolling where the lift generated by each roll eventually heads a boat toward a death roll or broach.

Jeff

[JohnRPollard]

One of the aspects I found most beguiling in this new Hoyt concept was the dampening effect created by the balanced portion (sail area forward of the mast) of the sail during a jibe. Presumably that same balance makes for lower sheeting forces, in much the same way that a a semi-balanced rudder feels lighter at the helm.

[sailingdog]

This might make it a good rig for a catamaran or a trimaran, which isn't that traditional a boat to begin with, and the offset sail wouldn't matter as much since it would be proportionally closer to the centerline on both tacks than on a monohull. However, building a freestanding mast on a catamaran can be problematic, so it might make more sense on a trimaran. Please note: I am not volunteering my boat.

Originally Posted by Jeff_H

As I look at this rig it probably is a great reaching rig in that it probably develops a lot of power reaching with comparatively little heeling, but my sense is that John Pollard is somewhat correct that in many ways this will behave like a lug rig, which in my experience requires a lot more sail area for a given amount of drive and at least in my experience heels more going to weather than you would expect given the low aspect ration as compared to other low aspect rigs like a gaff rig, and which is prone to excitation rolling where the lift generated by each roll eventually heads a boat toward a death roll or broach.

Jeff

[TrueBlue]

Hey SD,
Garry Hoyt's marketing the rig as a stand-alone componet - would be a great opportunity to work out a discounted deal.

[BigCat69]

For another out-of-the-box approach to making an easily handled but efficient offshore rig, check out my website at 65 Foot Sailing Catamaran Design by Tim Dunn

[Sasha_V]

ah...No. No, thanks.
But, you know, feel free to spam the board any time the mood takes you.

[BigCat69]

On a BBS, wouldn't spam be something off topic? My post wasn't off topic, though yours may be. In e-mail, spam is an unsolicited advertisement, but BBS' are meant to have unsolicited posts. I have drawings on my website of a rig which is not patented-anyone can use these drawings to make their own rig starting with my drawings, and I have many interesting, and mostly non-commercial links on my site. I'm an old yachtie, and I sailed a junk rigged boat across the Pacific in the 70s. I have been thinking about and using alternative rigs for over 30 years, and you put me in a category with 'Viagra' and 'organ enlargement' e-mails? I don't think that is in any way valid!

[Jeff_H]

I am not sure that I would call it spam, (which I would define as unsolicited advertising) but your post does seem to smack of self promotion, bordering on the forebidden 'advertising a product or service'.

Its an odd question here, because if Hoyt had posted the same original post that started this thread, he would be violating the no advertising provision, and in that same vein, I would say that your link to your website is as well. That said, the rig design on your web page is not far off topic, all even if its hard to understand why your website is relevant to the discussion.

I would respectfully suggest that instead of posting a link to your site, that you talk to the merits of the rig that you are showing and your personal experiences with it. By the way, I don't know how much time you spent with lug rigged mono-hulls but they are not a good combo. I also found that using a lug rig on a cat squanders the potential performance of the cat and makes tacking even harder than it already is with a cat. At least that was the case with the Wharrams.

Jeff

[Giulietta]

Can I be the Devil's advocate here??

I for one was reading with some interest his web site, and what he is proposing and doing...

I am a sucker for new stuff and like to be informed..I don't see, how, short of having to do a long post, he could have shown his inventions without the web page to wich he seemed to have dedicated a long time and effort...

Big cat..I thank you for showing the site, but next time, get someone else to post it for you, then you are not in violation..

We had a guy here a few months back that invented a clever cleat...he was pounded for showing his invention here...I eneded up showing it for him...and this way now laws were broken...

He is now a paying advertiser with sailnet..and seems happy...

We have (not so much now) been pretty well targeted with trolls and spammers in the past..thus the suspiciuous we have..