IORs for offshore sailing

[KeelHaulin]

Nice boat Faster; I looked at one prior to buying my N-41 but it was in rough shape. The boat you had looks much more 'cruisy' than the boat I had looked at; and definitely in better overall shape. The aft bunks were the same but the boat I looked at had a drop-leaf table in the middle with settees on either side. Now that I look at pictures of these boats again; they were nicely designed but it appears that many were raced very hard and not well looked after; so it depends on the particular boat in terms of what it would be worth (some listing in the high 40's are nice; others look in need of a full refit). How did it do in heavy wind? You mention tendency to broach; was that an issue with the Choate? We have not had that problem with the N-41 but again, it's a late CCA design.

The Choate I had looked at had a Pathfinder 25HP IIRC but I could be mistaken. Maybe they used smaller engines in some of them?

Sorry to the OP for the OT discussion...

[Faster]

Originally Posted by KeelHaulin

There's one on YW out of Seattle that is for sale; looks nice. Was that one yours?

No, ours is still in Canada, not far from Vancouver. That's another "custom" version with that deckhouse.. interior looks quite good, if a bit unusual. But it makes my point... a substantial 40' boat for not much more money than a fully tricked out Mac 26 and trailer.

This interior looks more nicely finished than ours was.

[bobmcgov]

Originally Posted by KeelHaulin

Sorry to the OP for the OT discussion...

By all means, please keep introducing me to these nice boats! Gorgeous work, Faster. One of the nice things about these boats is, as you guys said, general beefyness of fittings and flexible (if pokey) cabins. All Albins came without lined hulls; the furniture was built in rather than molded in. So a handy feller with a little time could really set one up for cruising.

Were IOR boats commonly under-engined as well? Most Albins came with cranky Volvo diesels, but many have been repowered. What about things like fuel and water tanks, holding tanks, electrical systems? Did IOR boats sometimes scrimp on these compared to heavy cruisers?

[bestfriend]

Bob
If you haven't found these threads yet, some interesting reads:

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/buying...html#post46172

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/sailbo...tml#post213069


THere is also a very long thread about comfort and the rise and fall of different bow angle designs, but I can't find it right now.

Bob

[KeelHaulin]

Originally Posted by bobmcgov

The Ballad is technically an IOR half-tonner, also raced in Scandinavia as a One Design. Slightly less exaggerated than some rules-beaters, and considered undersailed for pure racing. High coamings because cold water!

This is a typical end-era CCA/IOR-I hull. Very close in hullform to my N-41, Islander 30/36, Catalina 38-I. Of course there are design differences like the tumblehome on the Cat-38 but they all share the same basic design elements. The end-era IOR boats were lightly constructed, flat bottom, and more to the pure racing design in terms of performance and "twitchyness".

As I said before; roller reefing jib is a big help in controling the sailplan on these large-J masthead rigs. Yeah; I know it's "cheating" but a heavy dacron cruising genoa is not a performance sail anyway. A self-tacking staysail on a removable forestay would be a good addition for offshore passages where heavy winds are expected.

[bobmcgov]

Thanks, BF! The first thread especially is a great read. Can you think of 30ish footers from that era, in that $12-30k price range, that don't suffer from "white knuckle syndrome" but which sail well otherwise? All I've really seen are twitchy IOR boats or traditional, sluggy Alberg/Pearson/Westerly full-keelers.

This is a five-ten year plan. Probably by the time we actually go cruising, the market will be flooded with modern Benes and Juneaus at bargain prices. But darn, I love the lines on those 70s cruiser/racers. The new cruisers look ... extruded.

KH: Good info. And your boat is sexy! The early 70s Albins certain fall in the burlier/less racy category. Kinda awkward belowdecks, low volume and dark. I gots no beef with roller furling, if you think it will survive storms and not add too much windage. Re masthead rig: I'm guessing the compliment will be myself (not a big person) and my gal, not much of a sailor (yet). Should we restrict the search to fractional rigs? I have this vision of me on the foredeck, trying to wrestle down a torn 350sqft genny or unstick the roller furler, while my GF helms in 30 ft following seas, saying "Which way does the tiller go again?"

This is not a happy vision. I know from climbing trips what fatigue can do to motor skills and judgment, and how that fatigue is amplified by ornery equipment or inexperienced partners. We called it "Guide Mode," when the ablest climber takes over almost all duties and decision-making, and it wrings you dry. We need a boat we don't have to fight too much.

[RichP]

The good thing about a lot of old IOR designed boats is their sea worthiness, a lot of them were not so good, but there were also many very seaworthy examples.

I.e. in the Quarter tonne class:
GK24, Eygthene 24, Hunter Delta (Fin keel, and this is british hunter, not american) have all made offshore passages.

[blt2ski]

Something to think about, is some of the mid 80's 30'ish foot boats, while NOT IOR per say, they are geting a bit better designed spec to them, in such a manner that they are better sailed/handled etc. Some include boats like Jodys Barberous(sp?), my Jeanneau Arcadia and the slightly bigger Attalia, Sunshine 36 too. They have many of the what one needs and wants for off shore sailing to a degree.

My Arcadia is a half ton per IOR, but it is the latest and last half ton design by Tony Castro. So reasonbly fast etc. Not sure I would want to take her on a world cruise......but she would handle off shore work etc.

Plenty of options, just find what will work etc.

Marty

[catamount]

I have a Peterson 34 which has some IOR characteristics, but is still a great sea boat.

Regarding the opening questions on sail plan, the 170% genoa on this boat had long ago been abandoned given the rating hit under PHRF for anything bigger than 155%. But for short-handed cruising, we've gone with a 135% genoa on a roller furler, and have added a removable inner forestay for a hanked-on heavy weather jib (blade) and a small storm jib.

[RandyonR3]

Our boat, a mid 80s IOR design, (FIRST 42) has become our cruiser-fied home..
The IOR design takes a little getting used to as a cruising boat. Sailing dead down wind is one good example. with the pinched stern, they're a handfull in following seas and want to twist around.
BUT, 5 to 10 degrees off DDW, our feels like she was shot from a cannon, and running on tracks..
The weight is not an issue as when you set it up for cruising, as ours, you'll probably add a few thousand pounds to it which evens out its flighty movements and gives it super stibility.
I find that ours moves really good in light air, and becomes more stable as the wind picks up. Ours is cutter rigged so it gives us a wide arangement of avalable sail plans, and with all the performance rigging on the boat, we can tune the sails as the wind build......