Standing Rigging: Rod vs Wire - SailNet Community
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 11 Old 11-18-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 44
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
Standing Rigging: Rod vs Wire

Fellow sailnetters,

I would be interested in learning the pros and cons of rod versus wire standing rigging methods.

I have always heard rod was better, but, if so, why? Do both require tuning at similar intervals? With "normal" use, how long could each be expected to last before all new rigging needs to be installed - 10, 20, 30 years?

I am sure this topic has been covered before, but I have not been able to find. As always, thanks for the education.

Jim
SeaQwest
SeaQwest is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 11 Old 11-18-2010
Telstar 28
 
sailingdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,290
Thanks: 0
Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 14
         
Rod has pros and cons like any rigging.

Pros: Lighter, less weight aloft, lower windage, greater strength to weight ratio.

Cons: harder to inspect, can fail with little warning, harder to replace or repair in remote ports,

As for how long it lasts, it depends on whether you're on salt or fresh water, whether you sail year round or for just the sailing season, whether you race or just cruise, etc.


Wire rigging is heavier, creates more windage and has a lower strength-to-weight ratio than rod, but is easier to replace, can be replaced using all ship-board hand tools, is easier to inspect. You can easily carry spare wire-rope rigging, but carrying spare rod rigging is much more difficult.

Synthetic rigging, like Colligo's Dynex Dux-based rigging, is also a reasonable choice, but it is more expensive than wire rope or rod rigging generally. It is lighter and has a better strength-to-weight ratio than metal rigging, but is susceptible to being cut...

Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
sailingdog is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #3 of 11 Old 11-18-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 44
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
Thanks Sailingdog. I would have naively guessed rod to be the heavier of the two because it is suppose to be stronger and, of course, less flexible.

As for longevity, let's say the boat is docked in the northeast in saltwater, used 6 months a year as a coastal cruiser and never raced. Generally, I would assume the rigging, if wire, would be good for about 10 years. Would it be a significantly longer life span for rod rigging?

Which would be the more desirable rigging on a mid-size (35') coastal cruiser, occasionally bluewatered, never raced, mono-hull sailing vessel?

Wow...that "can fail with little warning" part is scary!

Thanks again.

Jim
SeaQwest
SeaQwest is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #4 of 11 Old 11-18-2010
Senior Member
 
tommays's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,296
Thanks: 1
Thanked 30 Times in 30 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Anything can fail without warning

We have rod on my friends the 35' and it was replaced at 20 ? some odd years of nothing but racing

The good thing is its Navtec and all top shelf stuff the bad thing is cost a LOT of money

The only real way to test the rod is to cut the end off and run it through the head forming machine

If it takes a new head its OK if not its BAD

1970 Cal 29 Sea Fever

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1981 J24 Tangent 2930
Tommays
Northport NY


If a dirty bottom slows you down what do you think it does to your boat
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tommays is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #5 of 11 Old 11-20-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 44
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
Thanks Tommays. 20+ years! It may cost more, but if you get twice the life span, it should be worth it.

Based on what I am hearing, rod seems to be the more desirable rigging.

Thanks.

Jim
SeaQwest
SeaQwest is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #6 of 11 Old 11-20-2010
Warm Weather Sailor
 
Vasco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,005
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
I have rod rigging on my CS36M. The boat has been down south for 8 trips so it's had salt and fresh water. Bought it in 1988, still going strong, 22 years. Kinked the forestay once when removing the mast, had to replace it. Other than that no problems. We remove the mast every fall and the rod rigging is a bit unwieldy compared with wire but you get used to it.

Rick I
Toronto in summer, Bahamas in winter.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Vasco is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #7 of 11 Old 11-20-2010
Just another Moderator
 
Faster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: New Westminster, BC
Posts: 16,372
Thanks: 101
Thanked 304 Times in 294 Posts
Rep Power: 10
     
Over the years we've had two rod rigging failures. One a D1 shroud, the other a deckstay, both on a 40 footer we owned previously. A quick tack saved the rig in the first instance.

Both failures were traced to seized rod end fittings in the turnbuckle barrel. (actually the deck stay had been welded to the turnbuckle... same effect) As it was explained to me, every time the load surges on a rig, eg going over a wave, there's a torsional stress applied (ie the rod twists and untwists a bit) The rod end is meant to move within the turnbuckle at this time. If the rod end is seized that stress 'works' the rod where it exits the turnbuckle, eventually failing there. Whoever welded our deckstay created the same scenario.

The rigging was, to our knowledge, original and about 15 years old at the time. We subsequently loosened the rig, opened up and freed all the rod ends, applying lanakote to keep the ends free and had no further issues - I believe the boat is still sailing today with the same rod, other than the replaced parts, now well over 20 years on.

There's lots to like about rod, but wire will often give you some warning, or more easily observed indication of pending failure.

Ron

1984 Fast/Nicholson 345 "FastForward"

".. there is much you could do at sea with common sense.. and very little you could do without it.."
Capt G E Ericson (from "The Cruel Sea" by Nicholas Monsarrat)
Faster is online now  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #8 of 11 Old 11-22-2010
Senior Member
 
paulk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: CT/ Long Island Sound
Posts: 2,602
Thanks: 4
Thanked 26 Times in 25 Posts
Rep Power: 16
 
We replaced our rod forestay a season back, when we put in roller-furling and found that the original forestay had a kink in it, hidden underneath the tuff-luff for we don't know how long. The rigger said the heads on the Navtec rod tend to crack through metal fatigue: repeated loading and unloading. He would have simply re-headed the original rod if it hadn't had the kink. We've raced our boat hard for the past 12 years, but she was built in 1981. We do look over the rig carefully each season, but not with dye or anything too fancy.
Things can break, anytime, of course. On a different boat I was on, we had a wire shroud suddenly let go in the Bay of Biscay, despite it's having been carefully checked over before the boat had sailed Transatlantic, up the Irish Sea to the Hebridies, and back down to the Gironde estuary.

Last edited by paulk; 11-22-2010 at 06:39 PM.
paulk is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #9 of 11 Old 11-22-2010
Junior Member
 
TomKeffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 22
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
Navtec offers an excellent (albeit very conservative) guide to inspecting rigging, including guides to the life expectancy of rod rigging.

S/V Velocity
J/42 #39
TomKeffer is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #10 of 11 Old 11-22-2010
Telstar 28
 
sailingdog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,290
Thanks: 0
Thanked 14 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 14
         
It depends. If you are going cruising, I would recommend wire, not rod, rigging. You can't really carry spare rod rigging very easily. You can't adjust the length of it without specialized tools, where mechanical fittings--like Hayn HiMod, StaLok and Norseman--allow you to shorten wire rigging with only basic handtools.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaQwest View Post
Thanks Tommays. 20+ years! It may cost more, but if you get twice the life span, it should be worth it.

Based on what I am hearing, rod seems to be the more desirable rigging.

Thanks.

Jim
SeaQwest

Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
sailingdog is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Q: Standing rig wire size ulferlingsson Gear & Maintenance 1 06-11-2010 10:17 AM
New Standing Rigging (wire) riphonda Gear & Maintenance 15 06-04-2009 02:36 PM
Wire Luff Sails (free standing furling) ranes Gear & Maintenance 2 07-04-2008 03:03 AM
which wire rope for hand press fittings / standing rig gjxj Gear & Maintenance 6 08-16-2006 11:19 AM
Standing rigging wire type ricekrgr Gear & Maintenance 1 03-28-2006 12:34 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome