Keel / Hull join - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest Forums > Boat Review and Purchase Forum > Sailboat Design and Construction
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By US27inKS
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 10-07-2011
SFU SFU is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 16
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
SFU is on a distinguished road
Keel / Hull join

Hi there,

I would like to have some feed back about something :

I was considering a boat (about 25 foot) where the owner was putting epoxy in the front of the keel where it joins the hull. When I asked if it comes from a grounding, he said that no, but since the boat was more than 30 years old this is usual that you need to consolidate that area.

I suppose it makes sense, but I expect normal tear to worm out the join everywhere, not only forward.

What do you think ?

SFU
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 10-07-2011
SloopJonB's Avatar
Senior Moment Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: West Vancouver B.C.
Posts: 10,347
Thanks: 55
Thanked 34 Times in 32 Posts
Rep Power: 3
SloopJonB will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFU View Post
Hi there,

I would like to have some feed back about something :

I was considering a boat (about 25 foot) where the owner was putting epoxy in the front of the keel where it joins the hull. When I asked if it comes from a grounding, he said that no, but since the boat was more than 30 years old this is usual that you need to consolidate that area.

I suppose it makes sense, but I expect normal tear to worm out the join everywhere, not only forward.

What do you think ?

SFU
It is very common - it's often called the "Catalina smile" or the "C&C smile". If the joint is opened up everywhere it's time to start worrying.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken, opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 10-07-2011
SFU SFU is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 16
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
SFU is on a distinguished road
ok, I see, thx !!

SFU
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 10-07-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 654
Thanks: 1
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Rep Power: 14
olson34 is on a distinguished road
Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by SFU View Post
Hi there,

I would like to have some feed back about something :

I was considering a boat (about 25 foot) where the owner was putting epoxy in the front of the keel where it joins the hull. When I asked if it comes from a grounding, he said that no, but since the boat was more than 30 years old this is usual that you need to consolidate that area.

I suppose it makes sense, but I expect normal tear to worm out the join everywhere, not only forward.

What do you think ?

SFU
A well engineered and constructed boat will not routinely see a keel separating from the hull. Calling it a "smile" (or a frown) does not change this or make it acceptable.

Look for damage around the keel nuts inside if the keel hit a hard bottom. This can also cause the rear of the keel to push up and fracture parts inside, as well.

If, OTOH, the whole hull layup is weak enough to let the keel weight pull down at any point due to hull flexing, the repair will involve strengthening the whole attachment area.

Some production boats had some plywood incorporated into the sump area as bearing material for the keel nuts and washers, and that wood rotted over the years. Dropping the keel and building up the inside should fix that situation.

One other part of preventative maintenance that should be mentioned, is that it's good to drop the keel for inspection of the "bolts" every 15 to 20 years.

What make n model is this boat?

L
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 10-07-2011
SFU SFU is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 16
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
SFU is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by olson34 View Post
Look for damage around the keel nuts inside if the keel hit a hard bottom. This can also cause the rear of the keel to push up and fracture parts inside, as well.
I saw the bolts from the inside : seems normal.
There was a little bit of water in the lowest part of the compartment, but since it look like the lower point of the cabin I suppose this is normal.

No sign of anything on the hull or rudder either.


Quote:
What make n model is this boat?
It was on a Hunter 25 from late 70's


Thx.

SFU
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 10-07-2011
SloopJonB's Avatar
Senior Moment Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: West Vancouver B.C.
Posts: 10,347
Thanks: 55
Thanked 34 Times in 32 Posts
Rep Power: 3
SloopJonB will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by olson34 View Post
A well engineered and constructed boat will not routinely see a keel separating from the hull. Calling it a "smile" (or a frown) does not change this or make it acceptable.

Look for damage around the keel nuts inside if the keel hit a hard bottom. This can also cause the rear of the keel to push up and fracture parts inside, as well.

If, OTOH, the whole hull layup is weak enough to let the keel weight pull down at any point due to hull flexing, the repair will involve strengthening the whole attachment area.

Some production boats had some plywood incorporated into the sump area as bearing material for the keel nuts and washers, and that wood rotted over the years. Dropping the keel and building up the inside should fix that situation.

One other part of preventative maintenance that should be mentioned, is that it's good to drop the keel for inspection of the "bolts" every 15 to 20 years.

What make n model is this boat?

L
All valid info and the keel SHOULD be checked thoroughly BUT I doubt there are many (or any) people who would say that C&C boats were not well engineered or built. The "smile" is a result of the small mounting base area of high aspect ratio keels, particularly if they are highly swept. Absent any heavy damage from grounding or failing bolts, they are commonplace and nothing to worry about.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken, opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 10-07-2011
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 654
Thanks: 1
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Rep Power: 14
olson34 is on a distinguished road
Unhappy

Quote:
Originally Posted by SFU View Post
It was on a Hunter 25 from late 70's
Thx.
SFU
Oh My. I used to crew a bit back in the 80's on that same model. Whole boat was kind of "floppy" in its general construction. The couple that sailed it then did a lot of cruising and a bit of low-key club racing in protected waters. It was a good boat for their usage.

I still recall that if anyone went forward to use the head while boat was going to weather, the sliding door could not reopened until the boat tacked back again!
Rumor has it that Hunter improved their engineering steadily in the last 20 years... and I hope it's true.



L
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 10-07-2011
US27inKS's Avatar
Midwest Puddle Pirate
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Gardner, KS
Posts: 2,160
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 11
US27inKS has a spectacular aura about US27inKS has a spectacular aura about
Another consideration that I did not see offered here was the quality of the original fairing material. A lot of production boats from the late 70's and early 80's used regular automotive body putty. This putty would crack at the hull/keel joint and sometimes large chunks of it would fall off. The fact that this body putty fails is no indication of a problem with the hull or the keel, just a bad filler.
SloopJonB likes this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
John USYacht 27 "Cora Lee"
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Refairing Keel Hull Join... Bit of a gap! RichP Gear & Maintenance 10 11-09-2009 12:09 AM
Rusty spots on keel and hull keel joint Stephane99 Gear & Maintenance 1 04-07-2009 07:39 PM
Keel Hull joint Seekswind O'Day 9 01-09-2007 12:12 PM
Come Join the Reggae/BBQ party at Hull Yact Club! NewsReader Mass Bay Sailors 0 07-29-2006 10:15 AM
Hull-Keel Joints SailNet Gear and Maintenance Articles 0 06-18-2002 08:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:30 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012