Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat - Page 76 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum > Sailboat Design and Construction
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree245Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #751  
Old 06-23-2013
wolfenzee's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: S/V Waltzing Matilda, Port Ludlow, WA (NW Puget Sound)
Posts: 497
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 7
wolfenzee is on a distinguished road
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Which is why instead of standing on the dock lusting after a 65' schooner I can kick back in a hammock in my own 30; cutter while I sail off into the tropical sunset.
Brent Swain likes this.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #752  
Old 06-23-2013
smackdaddy's Avatar
Last Man Standing
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 12,996
Thanks: 81
Thanked 73 Times in 67 Posts
Rep Power: 9
smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough smackdaddy is a jewel in the rough
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Actually, this is precisely why I'm so interested in Brent's numbers for building one of his boats. If the used ones are quite a bit more expensive (for smaller boats) than the Hunter 40 I just bought, I'm really perplexed how his boats are for the poor and downtrodden.

Let them eat cake I guess.

In the mean time, we're gonna be sailing our snazzy fiberglass yacht with its full compliment of absurdities into many sunsets while they read, watch and weld.

Just sayin'.

(PS - TD, that is a very becoming avvy. Chicks dig scars...and electrodes.)
JomsViking likes this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

S/V Dawn Treader - 1989 Hunter Legend 40

Last edited by smackdaddy; 06-23-2013 at 10:52 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
The Following User Says Thank You to smackdaddy For This Useful Post:
JomsViking (06-24-2013)
  #753  
Old 06-23-2013
tdw's Avatar
tdw tdw is offline
Super Fuzzy Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 14,353
Thanks: 5
Thanked 67 Times in 62 Posts
Rep Power: 10
tdw is a jewel in the rough tdw is a jewel in the rough tdw is a jewel in the rough
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfenzee View Post
Which is why instead of standing on the dock lusting after a 65' schooner I can kick back in a hammock in my own 30; cutter while I sail off into the tropical sunset.
gee I hope you are maintaining an effective watch ....
JomsViking likes this.
__________________
Andrew B

"Do you think God gets stoned? I think so... Look at the platypus." Robin Williams.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #754  
Old 06-24-2013
JomsViking's Avatar
Splashed
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 554
Thanks: 28
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 8
JomsViking is on a distinguished road
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdw View Post
gee I hope you are maintaining an effective watch ....
A hammock for the OoW is mandatory according to IMO (I think, maybe..)
__________________
Watch great footage about the story of one manís slow odyssey around the UK:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #755  
Old 06-24-2013
JomsViking's Avatar
Splashed
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 554
Thanks: 28
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 8
JomsViking is on a distinguished road
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Agree, although I can't phrase it as aggravatingly as You

With regards to the strength of the two materials, I subscribe to the idea of not hitting rocks, as NO hull material will save your bacon in that situation.
So spending time and money on navigation tools and skills + having a boat that can sail well is better than considering stell the only option IMO.


Now Hunter Owners, they're all crazy and smelly...

/Joms

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Actually, this is precisely why I'm so interested in Brent's numbers for building one of his boats. If the used ones are quite a bit more expensive (for smaller boats) than the Hunter 40 I just bought, I'm really perplexed how his boats are for the poor and downtrodden.

Let them eat cake I guess.

In the mean time, we're gonna be sailing our snazzy fiberglass yacht with its full compliment of absurdities into many sunsets while they read, watch and weld.

Just sayin'.

(PS - TD, that is a very becoming avvy. Chicks dig scars...and electrodes.)
smackdaddy likes this.
__________________
Watch great footage about the story of one manís slow odyssey around the UK:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #756  
Old 06-24-2013
wolfenzee's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: S/V Waltzing Matilda, Port Ludlow, WA (NW Puget Sound)
Posts: 497
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 7
wolfenzee is on a distinguished road
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

As far as a watch and hammock, the older (obsolete, antiquated) design of boat is the sort where to self steer requires no auto pilot, not wind vane.....just a tiller brake/lashed tiller will sail for days on end. My sail down to SF will test the self steering capabiities, the new re-rig to cutter will help balance out the rig and enable me to move the center of effort to where I want to fine tune.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #757  
Old 06-24-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 2,315
Thanks: 19
Thanked 32 Times in 31 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Brent Swain is on a distinguished road
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
I think most of this is actually a good post. I even liked it!

Brent, roughly how much would it take to build one of your 36's - start to finish and ready to cruise?
Depends on the owner, how much he can do himself, what kind of deals he comes up with in used gear, and how resourceful he is. Two were launced inth elast 5 years for $35,000 with very independent, resourceful owners. Like with any boat, there is no upper limit on how much one can spend, but planning and thought which goes into a boat produces a far better boat than does simply spending more money on one.
__________________
Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #758  
Old 06-24-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 2,315
Thanks: 19
Thanked 32 Times in 31 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Brent Swain is on a distinguished road
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by JomsViking View Post
Agree, although I can't phrase it as aggravatingly as You

With regards to the strength of the two materials, I subscribe to the idea of not hitting rocks, as NO hull material will save your bacon in that situation.
So spending time and money on navigation tools and skills + having a boat that can sail well is better than considering stell the only option IMO.


Now Hunter Owners, they're all crazy and smelly...

/Joms
On of my 36 footers,while leaving Suva, pounded across 300 yards of coral in a big sea, then was pulles back over it by a tug , with no visible hull dammage, to continue her circumnavigation. Many of my boats have hit the rocks at hull speed, with no dammage . That "NO hull will save your bacon in that situation" is a well disproven myth, propagated by those trying to sell hulls which wont ( or trying to justify buying hulls which wont).
__________________
Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #759  
Old 06-24-2013
grumpy old man
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,571
Thanks: 1
Thanked 72 Times in 68 Posts
Rep Power: 4
bobperry will become famous soon enough
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

"Many of my boats have hit the rocks at hull speed, with no dammage "

three knots?
mitiempo likes this.
__________________
Please visit my blog. It's fun to read.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Bob's Blog ....

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Please also visit my new web site
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #760  
Old 06-24-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 2,315
Thanks: 19
Thanked 32 Times in 31 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Brent Swain is on a distinguished road
Re: Bob Perry's take on Wolfenzee's dream boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Your refusal to provide even the scantest evidence to back up your claims really puzzles me. But, if you insist...I'll help you out...I'm just that kind of guy.

Your general premises are as follows:

1. You put a very high value on aesthetics.
2. Your boats are for the non-wealthy 99%.
3. Everything you do is superior to modern design and technology.

As for aesthetics:



(Wait - are those battens? WTH? Those idiots!)





Again, aesthetics are a very subjective thing. So I'll leave any conclusions to the great SN audience. But, personally, I would definitely not put the aesthetics of the boats/gear above (or below) on par with any modern sailing yacht - or any modern piece of equipment.

But, more importantly, let's look at your central claim that you are the designer for the masses by looking at listings for some of your yachts:

$31,000
1995 31' Swain
1995 Custom steel Brent Swain 31 sailboat for sale in Outside United States




$39,000
1997 27' Swain Motorsailer
Harbour Yacht Sales Ltd.




$56.000
2002 ??' Swain
?Dove IV? Brent Swain 2002--USED BOATS--skippers Houseboat



$76,000
1986 37' Swain
Used Brent Swain 12m for Sale | Yachts For Sale | Yachthub










$40,000
1998 36' Swain Cutter
1998 brent swain 36ft steel cutter brent swain 36ft steel cutter sailboat for sale in Outside United States





$89,000
1996 37' Swain
1996 Swain 37 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com



So, in a nutshell, between $30K-$40K for a sub-30' boat. And between $40k-$89K for a ~37' boat. That's kind of steep. How exactly is that serving the 99%? I definitely couldn't have gotten what I wanted in my budget with one of your boats.

So, aesthetics and "affordability" seem to be questionable.

As for the technology issues, I'll leave it to you to look through the equipment lists on these boats to determine how many of your clients eschew the "yachtie absurdities" of technology and convenience.

What should we look at next?

(PS - As for the things you said I said on stuff - what the hell are you talking about? My telling Sully he should sell his kit and buy a smaller boat so that HE CAN ACTUALLY GO SAILING instead of putting another 3-5 years and tens/hundreds of thousands into a build that's not going to have great results? Sorry dude. Try again.)
Thanks for posting these pictures. They clearly show the fairness you get with origami construction . None of hese bOats use any filler of any kind to achieve such fairness.
The first boat the Nuthin Wong was a one off. When I was selling my last boat back in the mid 80s the owner of the Wong wanted a hull of that shape. I promised him 100 houirs of work if he could find me a buyer. He showdd me the shape he wanted and I helped him and a friend pull her together. She is of an old classic Chinese design , not my design. She is an example of the extreme toughness of origami construction. She pounded on a solid rock reef in big seas for many days in the Balerics with zero dammage. you cna read abou tit in his book"No Fixed Adress By Clive Hamman. She has just survives 4 1/2 months pounding on a coral reef in Panama, again with zero damage to the hull. She is for sale.
The one in the second photo cruises BS waters every summer. I didnt design the winnabago wheelhouse. That ws the owners idea. I didnt build that one. She suffered zero dammage hitting the reef she is on.
The 4th photo is Dove 11 built especially for a single season passage thru the NW passage, which she completed with zero hull dammage despite some solid hull speed collisions with icebergs. That was Winston Bushnells second boat of my design, the first, a 36 , he did a Pacific circumnaigation, via the Marshal Islands , Carolines, Japan and the Aleutiians. T eon ebelow it is his third anothe rof my 36 footers which is for sale in Nanaimo. His daughter has one of my 26 footers ,modified to 27 ft, which is definitely not for sale.
Ullr was a good boat when she left BC. In Tonga I met a Kiwi kid who said she had been taken over by a halfwit who had built a massively heavy wheelhouse on her, a massively heavy diesel tank welded to the outside of the transom and modified the leading edge of the keel in a way which would give her a heavy weather helm, All done without contacting me in any way. This crap could all be easily cut off, and she could easily be returned to being the boat I designed.
That anchor winch by the mast was definitley not my idea.
The way my boats become available for low income cruisers is they build them themselves , using borrowed tools and used equipement from other cheap or free boats. They cut the cost of the boat in half by pay as you go eliminating bank interest. When I started my current 31 footer in 1984 I had $4,000. When I launched her a month later I had $40, but after that she was costing me nothing, and I could finish her as mony allowed. It cost me antoher $2,000 to get her sailng and liveable. When I moved aboard she was bare foam and bare plywood, and I finished her while living aboard, eliminating rent and other land living costs. I could build her as free building materials showed up. Meanwhile I was cruising and enjoying my freedom, no problems.
Someone who has gone to all that trouble expects to be paid for all the work he has saved the next owner, and deserves to be paid for it..
__________________
Brent Swain, Boat designer, Builder, and author of "Origami Metal Boatbuilding"

Last edited by Brent Swain; 06-24-2013 at 07:15 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bob Perry's Tragic Loss smackdaddy General Discussion (sailing related) 16 07-09-2013 10:57 AM
What's your dream boat? dovetailnj General Discussion (sailing related) 58 07-08-2013 12:48 PM
What's your dream boat??? DavidB.UK General Discussion (sailing related) 4 06-22-2013 04:06 PM
Perry's new Sunday blog bobperry General Discussion (sailing related) 12 11-07-2011 06:05 PM
A boat dream! pjboots Boat Review and Purchase Forum 28 03-22-2007 03:10 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:12 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.