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Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Seamanship & Navigation
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Seamanship & Navigation Forum devoted to seamanship and navigation topics, including paper and electronic charting tools.


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  #11  
Old 10-25-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomaz_423 View Post
Valiente, Falcon was lucky. If you would hit them with your boat you would hole and sink them.
Yes, I was discussing this with an insurer. I said I had insurance for OTHER people, and the reason I tied off to the dock with six 3/4" lines was because I had a dream once of my boat loose in a basin full of other boats in a gale...

The dream involved me showing up with a rubber mallet and some touch-up paint and walking through a crowd of weeping middle-aged men.
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  #12  
Old 10-25-2008
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I doubt that...since he was negligent IMHO... also, his leaving the scene of the collision does not bode well for him. A 289' boat is certainly not as maneuverable as a 40' boat. He probably could have avoided the collision if he had granted the MF the sea room it required. He probably also could have avoided the collision by firing up his engine or turning away...

Given that reports of the area that day say that it was fairly congested with lots of other boats wanting to get a good look at MF... and that MF was under the control of a very experienced harbor pilot IIRC, the MF was constrained in its movements by the other vessels around it... and it is pretty unlikely that an experienced harbor pilot accidentally side-swiped a 40' boat.

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Originally Posted by T34C View Post
My guess is the capt. of the 40 footer is busy holding his neck/back and looking for a lawyer. Maybe we'll see him in Chicago boat shopping!
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
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—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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Last edited by sailingdog; 10-25-2008 at 12:26 AM.
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  #13  
Old 10-25-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog View Post
BTW, Stand By, the smaller of the two boats, actually fled the scene of the collision.
Yes, that was implied by the series of shots which I viewed about sixty frames on. It looks like they are "pulled over" by some sort of cop RIB at some point.

Anyway, I posted it because it illustrates pretty well the physics of disparate masses in conflict...and that the rules won't bail out your bilges if you follow them too closely.
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Old 10-25-2008
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Well, they should have also considered the effects such a massive sailboat with truly impressive sails would have on the winds very locally to itself. If you've ever sailed close to another sailboat, even one less massive than the MF, you'd know the wind can get pretty squirrely in their wind shadow...and MF has a pretty massive wind shadow.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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Old 10-25-2008
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Is there a film? who took this photo at that angle? Are you sure this is not photo shop? just a question.
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  #16  
Old 10-25-2008
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I sail parallel to a tall ship (Empire Sandy; I've posted pics) here in Toronto, as they motorsail about as fast as I can go balls out, but I ALWAYS sail on the windward side and keep off about three boatlengths off their beam. That's 100 feet.

I treat large boats under sail or indeed any ship over twice my length very much like I treat streetcars when I bicycle: sure, they USUALLY don't make sudden moves, but that doesn't mean you rub against them!

I read part of that SA thread (never been there before), and it confirms two things: 1) People sure like to forward opinions without all the facts in, and 2) SA is a pretty unpleasant forum with more assholes than a proctologist's scrapbook.
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  #17  
Old 10-27-2008
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Val- I read part of that SA thread (never been there before), and it confirms two things: 1) People sure like to forward opinions without all the facts in, and 2) SA is a pretty unpleasant forum with more assholes than a proctologist's scrapbook.

Truer words have never been spoken.

I could be wrong, but don't think the "smaller" boat fled the scene. In fact I beliee they were racing. Was the MF and her pilot barging thru a race course?

Either way the "small" boat skipper forgot to factor in the Right of Weight rule.
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  #18  
Old 10-27-2008
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My guess is that he thought he could cross but didn't realize it was doing 20+ knots. Tonnage rules trump "Starboard" rules.
No matter how fast she was going the same rules for determining whether you are on a collision course would apply. If I had to guess, they didn't see her under the jib or worse, someone stepped away from the helm.

Not so long ago while beer can racing a tug came through the racing fleet pushing a barge. One boat was sailing shorthanded and didn't see it until the very last minute as it was blocked by their genny. They were able to avoid a collision, though.
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  #19  
Old 10-27-2008
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If I had to guess, they didn't see her under the jib
what about over the jib than?
Pretty hard to not see something that massive.
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  #20  
Old 10-27-2008
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what about over the jib than?
Pretty hard to not see something that massive.
Good point.
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