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Seamanship & Navigation Forum devoted to seamanship and navigation topics, including paper and electronic charting tools.


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  #11  
Old 02-02-2009
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I have given up on the larks head and would not recommend it as it has failed twice for me. Summer winds around here are in the upper 20's to low 30's most every afternoon so jib sheets get heavily loaded. Using 7/16 Vizzion I find the good old bowline knots are more reliable. Tie one enough longer than the other to keep them from "doubling up" as they round shrouds or baby stays. The other advantage is you can end for end the sheets when the knot end starts to chafe.
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  #12  
Old 02-03-2009
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Lance,

I read your well-written response with interest. Here's more BLAH, BLAH

As a solo sailor, I had to figure out new ways of doing things. For example, I soon learned I couldn’t run back and forth to the cockpit to haul in or let out... the mainsheet. On my Hans Christian, as with many boats, the mainsheet goes from aft blocks on the boom to the blocks near the mast before returning to the cockpit winch. I discovered I could let the main out as needed before going on deck and then hauling it in as needed at the mast. I often temporarily cleated it off there also and that gave me the extra time to do whatever had to be done.

Regarding jib sheet knots…I'll add two more cents although I don't think it is needed. As you know port and starboard sheets are usually tied separately with bowlines. Two shorter sheets, instead of one continuous line, are easier to handle and quicker to remove, Also, if one of the sheets needs replacing it only cost half the price.

On the other hand, two bowlines tied to the jib sheet can sometimes get hung up on a stay during tacking. Using a long jib sheet attached with the one, much smaller knot (described below), can lessen that problem.

ONE CONTINUOUS JIB SHEET KNOT (sorry no photos.)

1. Measure the entire length needed of, say the port jib sheet. Start at the port winch, and include not only extra line to wind on the winch or the length to the bow but also the additional feet needed to attach to the largest sail sheeted in on the starboard side. Double that figure to determine the total length of your CJS LINE.
.
2. Mark the middle of the CJS line with tape

3. Feed the line through the jib clew to the tape then coil each side of the line,( the Port and Starboard sheets)

4, Face the clew with the Port line in your left hand and Starboard in right hand. Pass the coiled Starboard line OVER the standing part held in the left hand, then up, around and through to form a half hitch. Now pass the Port coil UNDER the the standing part held in the right hand, then up, around and through to form a half hitch. Work the knots together until snug to the clew.
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Last edited by Cruisingdreamspress; 02-03-2009 at 03:24 PM.
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  #13  
Old 05-12-2009
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Alternatives for larger boats

Follow up on the same subject, so I'm dredging up this older thread. Since I already have two lines and I want to eliminate knots it looks like I need to splice an eye in the end. So far so good.

I also looked at the Attaching Jibsheets article.

Then the options are:

1) larks head (hard to undo)
2) Tylaska Spool Shackles
3) Tylaska J-Shackles
4) EquipLite Connectors (too expensive!)

Any thoughts on these. It seems like the Spool shackles might be a good compromise. Has anyone used these for genoa sheets on a larger (40'+) boat?
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  #14  
Old 05-12-2009
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Call me “old school”, but I’m still a fan of the bowline. I can tie it easily and quickly. I have never had one come undone or fail. And, when properly tied, I don’t have a problem with the knot hanging up on the forward shrouds (make sure that the loop and tail aren’t too large and the tail finishes inside, not outside of the loop).

If your sheet is properly sized and made of the correct material, any knot you tie should not weaken the line to the point of failure. Your sheet will be stretching and ruining your sail shape long before any potential breaks. If you are still worried about this, stop buying clothesline from home depot for your sheets!

I am probably a different than most sailors as my gear is more performance oriented. I run spectra genoa sheets and they are too expensive to leave them out, gathering (salt and grime) between sailing weekends. I take them off and put up a sacrificial line for my furled headsail. I have different colored whippings on each end so it is easy to constantly swap them end for end. I don’t get much wear from the knots, but I do get a lot of cover wear from my winches so swapping is a good idea for me.

When racing, we do peels and cruising bald headed changes while underway. Either way, I want to use the existing sheets rather than string new ones with each sail change. Also, on light air days with long runs or deep reaches, we will untie the lazy sheet entirely to get the weight off the clew. We will even swap out to our “dental floss” if conditions persist, so a simple, quick, reliable knot is important to us.

I have used the Tylaska J shackle and although light and compact, I have had difficulties in getting the pin out while wearing gloves. I have no experience with spool shackles, and I wonder how well they will hold up to a flogging headsail. They do look intriguing however.
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  #15  
Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

Here is the one continous sheet line knot that I have found works perfect for my sailboat. I think it's called a clove hitch. Screenshot2012-06-15at55057AM.png picture by dancamp009 - Photobucket
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  #16  
Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

'Old school' has a lot of experience to have as back up.

I have 2 seperate sheets, tied with a bowline. I have seen a genoa sheet come apart.

Slip knots like the above clove hitch can slip and slide along and a bowline will not slip.

I was told 2 seperate sheets as if one fails, the other is already tied on. I think this is good seamanship for safety reasons.

As to the knot weakening the line, I agree and every 18-24 months, I shorten or turn around the sheets. As to thickness, I use as thick as the car and winch will take. My Genny sheets are 16mm - just for the sake of my hands. When stretched, they seem about 14mm thick.

Its just what I do, its great to see what others have.
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  #17  
Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

I know they say the Clove Hitch knot will slip, but my jib sheets have never slipped. I read about this knot for this use years ago and went for it with perfect results. I sail a 40' (24000 LB) sloop with 5/8" double braid jib sheets on a big roller furled genoa in all reasonable conditions.
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  #18  
Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

I was thinking of using a figure eight knot with my single sheet. Seems more secure/easier to untie than a larks head. Also a bit cleaner than two bowlines with two sheets. As a side note, I think the climbing world has decided that the figure eight is stronger than the bowline. Haven't tested it yet so I will have to see how it will work. Certainly will be a PITA to tie compared to larks head.
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Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

GeorgeB makes some good points, but not to my application.Knot knowing much about jibs when I first raised one I simply used a long sheet doubled to the clew with a cow hitch. They are like permanent on the jib and stow on a belaying pin. Each jib is on its stay so no sail changes. I'm not racing and ease of management everything. Never slipped but replacement would be all or nothing. 22 tons, sailing daily.
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  #20  
Old 06-15-2012
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Re: Jib sheet knots

Here is a dumb question: How difficult is it to undo a bowline from the jib after it has been loaded for hours? Does it ever get tight enough to require a fid?
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