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Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Seamanship & Navigation
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Seamanship & Navigation Forum devoted to seamanship and navigation topics, including paper and electronic charting tools.


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  #11  
Old 06-29-2010
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I was thinking of putting a couple large plastic garbage cans off the bow, sunk a few feet below the surface. That will provide some inertia and water resistance forward where it is needed to let the boat rotate (yaw) at more forward point than the keel is providing.

Other than moving the wet rotation point forward, the other thing to do is to move the wind pressure aft, like with a riding sail. There's a guy on eBay that sells them every couple weeks for $49. (I've asked him about making a bigger one for larger boats. He's looking into it.)

One question is "How big does the anchor sail need to be?" My thoughts are that it needs to be a bit bigger than you would think, but that's based on little or no information. It might pay to get an old storm jib and attach it to your backstay to see if it has enough affect. The cut will be wrong, since anchor sails should be flat, but it would tell you something.

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  #12  
Old 06-29-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bene505 View Post
......One question is "How big does the anchor sail need to be?" My thoughts are that it needs to be a bit bigger than you would think, but that's based on little or no information. It might pay to get an old storm jib and attach it to your backstay to see if it has enough affect.
It need not be very large.. the one we use down south is maybe 6 feet on the 'luff' and with a 4-5 foot LP - much smaller than any storm jib you're likely to have aboard.

This little riding sail nicely settled the B 36.7 down, but I imagine that sitting in 15-20+ knot trades requires a smaller sail than lighter conditions.

As an aside, you'll often notice ketches and yawls with their mizzens set at anchor - usually for the same reason. Of course, with the normal camber of the sail it tends to slat a bit which I'd find annoying, a properly flat riding sail doesn't have that tendency and is not working in the 'lee' of any mast at all.
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  #13  
Old 06-30-2010
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Originally Posted by SJ34 View Post
I have never been able to get my San Juan 34 to stay put with a single anchor setting. It will sail all over the place and, if the winds are strong enough, will eventually wrap the chain around the set and drag. I always set out bow and stern anchors at night or if I leave the boat.

The problem is that in very crowded anchorages I am always on the look-out for swinging boats. That usually leaves us in the outer reaches where it is very bumpy or crammed into some pretty tiny holes with little room for cushion in case of emergency.

Anybody have any suggestions?
SJ,

If you are needing to set two anchors for routine anchoring, you definitely have a problem that needs fixing. Plus, you are not going to make any friends by dropping a stern anchor in an anchorage where everyone else is swinging on one anchor -- that's a fairly serious breach of anchoring etiquette. And, while you seem to be minimizing the effect on your neighbors by heading out to the periphery of the anchorage, doing so is a pretty big inconvenience and hassle for you, I'm sure. So we need to find a solution for you.

The riding sail suggestion is a good one. We've used them in the past with great results.

You didn't mention whether you have a roller-furling headsail, but these can be another big factor in how much a boat swings at anchor. Some boats just don't do well with all that windage forward. The riding sail can help counter that windage, as would making sure you get a VERY TIGHT furl to reduce windage. But with some boats, the best bet is to drop the roller furled headsail while at anchor in any amount of wind.

I also would agree that your choice of anchor/rode combination is less than ideal and probably contributes to the overall problem. The typical-sized danforth-style anchors are fine as supplementary anchors, but do not usually make the best bowers. You might consider a beefier arrangement and adding more chain to your rode.
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  #14  
Old 06-30-2010
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FYI—

Bower= Primary anchor
Kedge= Secondary anchor
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  #15  
Old 06-30-2010
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I suggest you try anchoring off the stern since it is free to try and easy. Anchor as normal and then walk the rode to the stern cleat. It also offers the advantage that it directs the breeze into the cabin on hot days. Not a good solution if the wind is really honking but good overall.
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  #16  
Old 06-30-2010
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BTW, if you're wondering why anchoring from the stern works... see Don Jordan's explanation at his website.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
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her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

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  #17  
Old 06-30-2010
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Our 32 Pearson also 'sails' at anchor. We use 50' of chain followed by 200' of 3 strand nylon which holds well.

Last October, when anchored by the Naval Academy in Annapolis for the boat show, we observed that every boat around us sat still while we visited every boat within swing room. I payed out more rode, from 120' to 200' but found ourselves visiting different boats.

We had pleasant conversations with the other sailors but would have rather met them in a bar than 10' from their boats with the apprehension that we might need to fend off.

I suspect that the other boats were held still by the weight of their all-chain anchor rode which draped directly down over the bow while our nylon flexed tight with each puff. We were the only boat with chain/nylon and the only boat that sailed on the anchor.

Could that be a solution to the swing problem?
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  #18  
Old 06-30-2010
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I appreciate all of the advice guys. I owe you all a round of barley pops.

In all the years I've been sailing I can count the times on two hands that I've had to anchor overnight. In SoCal it just isn't necessary until you get to the more remote areas. I'm an expert at docking in all conditions...and picking up a mooring ball though.

John, I do have a furling headsail and it did occur to me that I should probably take it down while at anchor. I'll drop it this weekend to see what effect that has.

I won't have a riding sail in time for this weekend but my better half is handy with a sewing machine and I have a stack of sails from past boats, so I may try to whip something up. How is the luff supported, does it have extra ribbing or a batten to keep it from collapsing, halyard or?

I can see the logic in nylon stretch being partly to blame for my swing. I can't see it snubbing but I'll watch for it next time. Adding more chain isn't going to make weighing anchor fun without a windlass but for peace of mind I'm willing to give it a shot.

SD, does rudder position matter when anchored from the stern?
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  #19  
Old 06-30-2010
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You don't need to replace the nylon with chain, although that would also help if the rope is at fault, rather you would replace it with less stretchy rope - multi-braid polyester would be an improvement. The problem is lots of folk use a long length of nylon, 3-strand the worst, without thinking about how much stretch they're introducing.

Rudder position can help disrupt things. Running the rode off-center is probably a better idea. The boat will still sail about though, you are not fixing the fundamental issue(s).
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  #20  
Old 06-30-2010
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Craig, what kind of rode do you suggest?
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