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post #41 of 62 Old 12-07-2011 Thread Starter
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Sorry, meant clipping on directly without jackline.

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post #42 of 62 Old 12-07-2011
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Well, I'll add my .02.
Several thousand miles offshore on a variety of boats/variety of conditions, at least half racing...where I do bow.

I don't ALWAYS clip on but should. At night and when it's rough I do. And I have found that the double tethers w/ a 6' and 3' tether are very helpful. When working on the bow changing sails I can clip on w/ the short end and stand up to put tension on the tether. That combined w/ my two legs basically make a tripod that allows me to "ride" the up/down of the waves.

I also have no pride about rolling around on the foredeck if necessary to tie down the sail after a sail change. (drop one sail and lash it to the rail so you can change it back up!) Stay crouched low and always have one hand on the boat going fwd and back.
You find that it becomes second nature in how to move around and where to clip on.
Another advantage of having the double tether is you can use one to go fwd and then clip on to a hard point up fwd w/ the other. Take your pick which one depending on how much mobility you need.
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post #43 of 62 Old 12-07-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjcaudle View Post
If clipping directly to a padeye with jackline, the line needs to be short. The force of a person falling 6 feet with a wave can pull out the attachment point unless it is very strong.
Most boats that I use have padeyes in the cockpit. We attach a 6 foot tether, not a jackline, to the padeye.

I might also use padeyes at the base of the mast.

In either case the long tether will keep inside the boat.

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post #44 of 62 Old 12-08-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
Well, I'll add my .02.
Several thousand miles offshore on a variety of boats/variety of conditions, at least half racing...where I do bow.

I don't ALWAYS clip on but should. At night and when it's rough I do. And I have found that the double tethers w/ a 6' and 3' tether are very helpful. When working on the bow changing sails I can clip on w/ the short end and stand up to put tension on the tether. That combined w/ my two legs basically make a tripod that allows me to "ride" the up/down of the waves.

I also have no pride about rolling around on the foredeck if necessary to tie down the sail after a sail change. (drop one sail and lash it to the rail so you can change it back up!) Stay crouched low and always have one hand on the boat going fwd and back.
You find that it becomes second nature in how to move around and where to clip on.
Another advantage of having the double tether is you can use one to go fwd and then clip on to a hard point up fwd w/ the other. Take your pick which one depending on how much mobility you need.
I use the same tether. I find that putting the free end in a pocket keeps it from getting tangled and frees a hand. I just take a wrap around the mast with the long one which negates any possibility of going over from there. A large padeye at the bow serves the same purpose as well as one in the cockpit. The jacklines would keep me attached to the boat but would certainly stretch to allow going over the side, even with the short tether. I really doubt whether anyone could actually get back on board once being dragged along on a tether, especially on the windward side. I have a fold down ladder off the stern with an emergency pull so that it can be released from the water but the prospect of actually getting to it once overboard is very doubtful. Testing this in real conditions is impossible. The tether and jacklines would surely snag somewhere, probably on the stanchions. Staying clipped in is a major PITA but I have set it as a personal rule to have harness on and tether attached when cruising.

It is just at those times when everything seems hunky-dory that you are prone to some stupid move, tossing you over the side. The only times I may be unclipped in are when in harbor, within hailing distance to a lot of other boats, or close enough to swim to shore.

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post #45 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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For those who use jack lines, what material do you use? As mentioned earlier, flat webbing is good because regular, round, line rolls underfoot. But my webbing is nylon, I think, and it really stretches when it gets wet. I can't keep just the right tension on them. And these were billed as jack lines when I bought them.
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post #46 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RossC32 View Post
For those who use jack lines, what material do you use? As mentioned earlier, flat webbing is good because regular, round, line rolls underfoot. But my webbing is nylon, I think, and it really stretches when it gets wet. I can't keep just the right tension on them. And these were billed as jack lines when I bought them.
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They do stretch when wet. Some folks will wet them before attaching them. When they dry, they are REALLY tight. I just tighten them on a winch when I attach them. A little slack does not concern me.

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post #47 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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The nylon webbing material does certainly stretch a bit but after a while they seem to tighten up. I have one long, double-ended piece which loops under a bow cleat and then runs down each side to some hefty shackles aft of the helm. Once installed and wet it tightens up. There is always going to be stretch in these things along a 30' span---enough to let you go over the side. With a crew to haul you back up there is no problem. If you are single-handed it's an entirely different situation: there is no help to haul you back up. This puts any kind of lifeline's usefulness in question. A better alternative when alone is to have enough fixed points of attachment so that you cannot possibly be swept off the deck. That means around 5' of slack, a very short tether, where the beam is 10' and even shorter up on the bow which is difficult to achieve. It can be done by using both clips of a double tether, triangulating to both sides which, on my boat, looks like it will probably keep my upper body on the deck. I have never had to be up on the bow with green water trying to wash me off but it is the most dangerous place in my mind.

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post #48 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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Not that I am off shore, but my jack lines go from the back of the cabin top to a cleat on the bow. Mostly or the bow folks when racing in heavier winds weather etc. I have tethers for those that want them while up that way. If I was off shore, or for some of the SH/DH races here in Puget Sound, one is required to be tethered a lot while in the cockpit also. I would have a line in the cockpit. Attach myself here, then as noted, use a tether with two attachment points, attach the loose end to the front, release the cockpit tether, then go forward, reverse when going back to the cockpit.

I happen to use 1" climbing webbing I get from a local climbing supply. Probably not quite as strong as real jacklines.......then again, if these line will protect me from a fall when I could go down some 2-3000' on Prusick peak, or down a cravase on Rainer.....they'll work for sailing thank you very much!

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post #49 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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Quote:
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If I was off shore, or for some of the SH/DH races here in Puget Sound, one is required to be tethered a lot while in the cockpit also. I would have a line in the cockpit. Attach myself here, then as noted, use a tether with two attachment points, attach the loose end to the front, release the cockpit tether, then go forward, reverse when going back to the cockpit.
Rather than having individual tethers, I place tethers strategically; in the cockpit, base of the mast, and on the jacklines. As you move around you attach a new tether to your harness before removing the old one.

The cockpit mounting points are U bolts.

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post #50 of 62 Old 12-27-2011
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Some stretch is not bad...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RossC32 View Post
For those who use jack lines, what material do you use? As mentioned earlier, flat webbing is good because regular, round, line rolls underfoot. But my webbing is nylon, I think, and it really stretches when it gets wet. I can't keep just the right tension on them. And these were billed as jack lines when I bought them.
Ross
... since without it they will break. Check the calculations. You need some energy absorption.

Sail Delmarva: Sample Calculations for Jackline Stress and Energy Absorption

(when asked how he reached the starting holds on a difficult rock climbing problem that clearly favored taller climbers - he was perhaps 5'5")

"Well, I just climb up to them."

by Joe Brown, English rock climber




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