Rule 23a question - Page 2 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Seamanship & Navigation
 Not a Member? 

Seamanship & Navigation Forum devoted to seamanship and navigation topics, including paper and electronic charting tools.


Like Tree1Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #11  
Old 12-19-2012
davidpm's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Madison
Posts: 3,818
Thanks: 206
Thanked 50 Times in 42 Posts
Rep Power: 8
davidpm is on a distinguished road
Re: Rule 23a question

(c | d) (i) A power-driven vessel of less than 12 meters in length may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and sidelights.

So your motoring back to the slip and your mast head light goes out.
As long as navigation lights are working just flip on your anchor light and pop the bulb out of your stern light and you are legal.
Jackdale?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #12  
Old 12-20-2012
jackdale's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 8,966
Thanks: 27
Thanked 54 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
jackdale will become famous soon enough
Re: Rule 23a question

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
(c | d) (i) A power-driven vessel of less than 12 meters in length may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and sidelights.

So your motoring back to the slip and your mast head light goes out.
As long as navigation lights are working just flip on your anchor light and pop the bulb out of your stern light and you are legal.
Jackdale?
Pretty much



Navigation Rules Online

That is a good site.
__________________
__________________
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor Evaluator
Sail Canada Advanced Cruising Instructor
IYT Yachtmaster Coastal Instructor
ASA 201, 203, 204, 205, 206, 214
As I sail, I praise God, and care not. (Luke Foxe)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #13  
Old 12-20-2012
smurphny's Avatar
Over Hill Sailing Club
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Adirondacks NY
Posts: 2,924
Thanks: 67
Thanked 67 Times in 65 Posts
Rep Power: 6
smurphny is on a distinguished road
Re: Rule 23a question

Interesting, I've just been reading over section 23 and 24. They are two of the more difficult, especially when the rules change for varying locations. It does seem nonsensical to have different rules for different places. Changing light patterns as in, "...below the Huey P Long Bridge...." seems really pointless.
jrd22 likes this.
__________________
Alberg 35: With a philosophical flourish Cato throws himself upon his sword; I quietly take to the ship.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #14  
Old 12-20-2012
jackdale's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 8,966
Thanks: 27
Thanked 54 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
jackdale will become famous soon enough
Re: Rule 23a question

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurphny View Post
Interesting, I've just been reading over section 23 and 24. They are two of the more difficult, especially when the rules change for varying locations. It does seem nonsensical to have different rules for different places. Changing light patterns as in, "...below the Huey P Long Bridge...." seems really pointless.
I find the Inland rules much easier to follow as the demarcation lines better define the areas better than the Canadian modifications. Some of the mods apply in "In the Canadian waters of a roadstead, harbour, river, lake or inland waterway." I took me quite a while to get that to sink in.
__________________
__________________
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor Evaluator
Sail Canada Advanced Cruising Instructor
IYT Yachtmaster Coastal Instructor
ASA 201, 203, 204, 205, 206, 214
As I sail, I praise God, and care not. (Luke Foxe)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #15  
Old 12-20-2012
L124C's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,388
Thanks: 48
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 8
L124C is on a distinguished road
Re: Rule 23a question

[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
Tri-color lights are allowed for both offshore and inshore under 20 meters.
Not to high jack the thread but I'm confused. I previously thought this was the case, and was proved wrong (I believe on a Sailnet thread). So now, I thought it must apply to motoring only. However, in reviewing the regs, it seems it makes no difference. Has something changed in the past few years?

Quote:
One advantage is that the lights distract the helmsmen less high up.
A side light can reflect off the head-sail at deck level causing glare.
On every boat I've been on, the helmsman can't even tell if the running lights are on (Stern light notwithstanding), without going forward. I thought they were supposed to be designed that way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #16  
Old 12-20-2012
davidpm's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Madison
Posts: 3,818
Thanks: 206
Thanked 50 Times in 42 Posts
Rep Power: 8
davidpm is on a distinguished road
Re: Rule 23a question

[quote=L124C;964919]
Quote:
Not to high jack the thread but I'm confused. I previously thought this was the case, and was proved wrong (I believe on a Sailnet thread). So now, I thought it must apply to motoring only. However, in reviewing the regs, it seems it makes no difference. Has something changed in the past few years?



On every boat I've been on, the helmsman can't even tell if the running lights are on (Stern light notwithstanding), without going forward. I thought they were supposed to be designed that way.
I went to a school with a fellow who claimed he was never wrong except once when he thought he was wrong but was mistaken. I'm not aware of any changes, just reading the book. It says what it says.

As far as the helmsman seeing the lights, I agree with you that on most boats you can't see the red and green except as a reflection off a sail sometimes but the stern light often sets up a glare reflecting off of shiny metal or polished fiberglass.
When it happens it really bothers me.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #17  
Old 12-20-2012
jackdale's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 8,966
Thanks: 27
Thanked 54 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
jackdale will become famous soon enough
Re: Rule 23a question

[quote=L124C;964919]
Quote:
Not to high jack the thread but I'm confused. I previously thought this was the case, and was proved wrong (I believe on a Sailnet thread). So now, I thought it must apply to motoring only. However, in reviewing the regs, it seems it makes no difference. Has something changed in the past few years?
A sailboat under propelled by machinery (under power) may not use a masthead tricolor. A sailing vessel is defined in Rule 3.

Note I used the term sailboat, not sailing vessel, in the first sentence,


Quote:

On every boat I've been on, the helmsman can't even tell if the running lights are on (Stern light notwithstanding), without going forward. I thought they were supposed to be designed that way.
I have been a couple of sailboats in which we could see a reflection of the sidelights from the cockpit.
__________________
__________________
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor Evaluator
Sail Canada Advanced Cruising Instructor
IYT Yachtmaster Coastal Instructor
ASA 201, 203, 204, 205, 206, 214
As I sail, I praise God, and care not. (Luke Foxe)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #18  
Old 12-22-2012
davidpm's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Madison
Posts: 3,818
Thanks: 206
Thanked 50 Times in 42 Posts
Rep Power: 8
davidpm is on a distinguished road
Re: Rule 23a question

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackdale View Post

Note I used the term sailboat, not sailing vessel, in the first sentence,
Why?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #19  
Old 12-22-2012
jackdale's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 8,966
Thanks: 27
Thanked 54 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
jackdale will become famous soon enough
Re: Rule 23a question

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
Why?
A sailboat can be any vessel with a mast and sails. A sailing vessel is specifically defined in Rule 3.

Quote:
(c) The term "sailing vessel" means any vessel under sail provided that propelling machinery, if fitted, is not being used.
A sailing must must be using sails only as a means of propulsion. You can run the engine to charge batteries, cool the fridge, make water. But as soon as you engage the transmission the sailboat becomes a power driven vessel.

Quote:
(b) The term "power-driven vessel" means any vessel propelled by machinery.
__________________
__________________
ISPA Yachtmaster Offshore Instructor Evaluator
Sail Canada Advanced Cruising Instructor
IYT Yachtmaster Coastal Instructor
ASA 201, 203, 204, 205, 206, 214
As I sail, I praise God, and care not. (Luke Foxe)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rule 10 and rule 18? JohnnyJupiter Racing 11 08-28-2012 02:44 PM
Nav Rule Question on the Use of Radar on Sailboats Triquetra Seamanship & Navigation 13 07-21-2011 06:01 PM
Start rule question different fleets NotQuiteCapnRon Racing 21 11-27-2010 11:39 AM
Rule Question please d212 Racing 5 02-03-2007 10:59 AM
The Rule of 60 John Rousmaniere Her Sailnet Articles 0 08-08-2004 09:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:27 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.