Close encounter with a large tug- in fog

[TwentySeven]

Hi all, this is my first post here.
I really appreciate all this crossed lesson (although scary at moments). I'll print this thread and study it carefully (as my English is not good enough to catch everything at first reading).
These experiences you mention remind me of an accident in the English Channel: the ferry Pride of Bilbao made Ouzo sink. Ouzo was a small sailboat with three man, who were found dead days after. The British Marine authorities run a very thorough investigation and issued the report (ouzo.pdf) that can be seen at www maib.gov.uk/publications/investigation_reports/2007/ouzo.cfm
It was a lesson to me on how you depend on yourself and can not rely at all on the expectation that "they will see me", first; then "they should have seen me", .... and end up at "Oh my God, they don't see me!"
It is also very instructive the QinetiQ report: Performance Investigation of Marine Radar Reflectors on the Market.
Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

PS: if you are interested in the link you should replace the space after www with the usual dot (the system would not allow me to post the link since it is my first post here)

[denby]

Welcome aboard TwentySeven, this thread has been very good and I've learn a lot. Thanks sway for the post. Sway is right about blips on a radar scope, they don't mean a thing unless you are plotting them. I have a plotting board on my boat and use it in fog and at night, very simple and helpful. Thanks again sway and see you on the solar thread.

Dennis

[wind_magic]

Sometimes you'd swear they were getting close to you just to check you out, to see what kind of a boat you have. Now I'm off to actually read the rest of the thread.

Sailaway21, great posts, thanks for that! Really makes me think.

[camaraderie]

Moving this to the Seamanship thread per request!

[YorktownSailor]

Perhaps you may have been able to contact him on ch 13, 12 or 9.

[wind_magic]

You know what else this thread makes me think of ? It makes me think that I'm going to find some tug boat and big ship captains to talk to. I'm going to keep my ears open and when I hear somebody talking about such-and-such tugboat captain I'm going to find out where they are and go ask them some questions. I'd love to just say something like ... "Hey, I sail a small boat and I'm worried about getting run over by tugboats, what should I do", and just let them start talking and see what they say. It would be nice to have perspectives from the very people you are trying to avoid being run over by, to see what they wish you would do so they don't have to get close to you, etc. I mean what's that gonna cost me, couple beers maybe.

I did that just the other day at the gasoline station. There was one of the tanker trucks there and it was really late in the morning like 3am and this guy was standing there filling the gasoline station's fuel tanks. So I walked over and was like .. "Hey, where's this gasoline come from", and he starts telling me all about the pipelines and where they run and where he drives the fuel from and just all this crazy stuff, it was fun to hear it all, I didn't even know where our local fuel depot was until I talked to him. And he was telling me about the heating oil people have to go down to the pipeline depot and bring trucks of oil up so they can distribute it out to my house, and all about the natural gas pipeline, I mean he knew all kinds of interesting things. And all for the price of nothing, just standing there talking to some guy while he's waiting for the tank to fill up.

[sailaway21]

While I appreciate the kind compliments, I am afraid they are misplaced. Bill Trayfors of many others could have posted similar remarks to mine, probably better stated. John Davidson deserves all of the credit because he brought a harrowing personal experience here in a quest for knowledge. A fellow, who's name escapes me at the moment, did similarly this summer about some sailing on the Chesapeake in squalls. The credit is all their's as they were willing to write down personal experiences that intrigue and educate us all. I think it will be noticed that the best threads all seem to share what those posts brought; an honest account of actual events on the water with a desire for information from similarly situated sailors. Nothing arm-chair about it at all. Kudos to John for a good topic and accounting.

[Faster]

Sailaway, you are too modest. I think having your perspective on John's adventure has put all of us in a better position of understanding this issue.

And John deserves credit, as you say, for initiating the thread as he did, and especially for taking your initial comments in the correct context.

Kudos to you both.

[Raggbagger]

I was delivering a 50ft Bristol Sloop out of the Chessapeake to Florida few years ago . The skipper was an Old (really old ) salt and decided with the clock started we where leaving regardless of the fog . I have never seen fog this thick and I would never have pushed off in it if the decision was mine . The Cap said it would burn off in a couple of hours and it did , but very creepy heading out into it. As we went on into the Bay the sun came out and turned the entire view briliant white . It was like being inside a marshmallow only brighter . So were plodding along at 2 to 3 kts but at least were plodding so the cap is happy . I look at the radar screen and see what apears to be about 6 boats in front of us I yell at the top of my lungs and the cap grinds it into reverse bringing us to a complete dead stop . We strain or eyes into the briliant whiteness , nothing , go below deck check the radar screen , nothing , " I swear there was half a dozen boats right there Cap "
" Ok whatever " he gets behind the wheel and off we go again 2 kts tops .
the whiteness continues blinding even with sunglasses. Im fixed on the radar and there are those boats again dead in front of us . Woah Cap I yell again .
come up on deck look around after another abrupt stop . Nothing, back down look at the screen , again nothing, ok I'm losing my mind or this radar is broken . This happens 2 more times before I figured out that we had actually been pushing a flock of seagulls down the Bay as we got close to them they took off and landed about a mile or so ahead of us . Ever felt like nature was playing games with your head .
I sure am glad your run in with the tug turned out well , some of em will not talk on the radio , I never understood it but it seems to be a trend . Then again some of em will talk to you and plan your aproach or pass one whistle or two .

[chris_gee]

It seems to me that the essence of the problem has perhaps been overlooked.
Sequitur correctly cites the relevant rules, namely that one alters course to starboard when not in a situation of visibility.
One can best do that if proceeding on the west side of the lanes, as the correct move of altering course to starboard takes you out of the danger zone, rather than putting you in it, and enables you to pass correctly.
It would probably be unwise to rely on complex radar interpretation, rather the basics of passing port to port and making one's intentions clear by substantial clear course alterations.