Rigging a 3rd reef underway

[labatt]

Y'all can put messengers wherever you want, but having been out in some pretty big winds and some good sized seas, I just can't see how you could play around with trying to rig up the third reef. The lines would be flogging all over the place, and I think trying to pull out the first reef to get it through the third spot would just be dangerous at any point when bouncing through waves. We added a cheek block to the side of our boom for the leech end and use two line reefing (so the tack is also controlled via a line). Yes, there is additional weight, but in under 30 seconds I can put our third reef in, and do it from under our dodger. So, to each their own.

[cormeum]

Agreed,The most sensible thing is to have them reeved (3 bails, 3 lines, 3sheaves). Then it's (pretty) quick and painless. We also have a trysail but that's sized at about 2/3 the size of the 3rd reef. If you have an inner forestay and runners, the mast will stay in column. Our "big" stays'l matches up with the 3rd reef and the "little" stays'l matches up with the try in relative reduction of area.

I wouldn't want to be in conditions that would require the try and little stays'l.

[bobmcgov]

Since the 3rd cringle is so high and you don't want a lot of heavy line up there, flopping around and chafing the sail or screwing up leech shape ... would you consider using a very light, slick, and small-diameter high-tech line for the purpose? That is, instead of using a thin messenger line to pull a fat line thru, why not use super-strong 3/16" spectra or Vectran and call it good? Tensile strength of 3800 and 5500 lbs, respectively. It won't weigh or chafe any more than the messenger line, and you can dispense with the whole switcheroo -- which, as others have noted, is not the kind of fine work you want to be doing in 3-reef conditions.

It would leave a long fall to deal with, but you gotta stow the messenger line anyhow. Whip a dozen coils on it, tie it off, and stuff it deep into the flaked mainsail. Front cringle could use a second line or a tack hook, right?

Re: trysail vs. third reef. Understand the concern. Unless you are using a babystay that coincides with your lowered tack (where the leech tension acts like a backstay of sorts), there could be mast pumping. But doesn't a trysail have the same problem? Most I have seen share the main mast track or utilize a second luff groove, & they only hoist part way.

[mgiguere]

Heaving to is a big part of the solution. Have used that technique to reef in heavy weather in the past. It puts the main in the middle of the boat and takes a lot of the pressure of it at the same time.

A couple of summers ago, I sailed with some friends out of France in the English channel. A third reef was standard fare on most of the boats I saw...forget about the "inconvenience" of having it hooked up all the time.

Moe

[cormeum]

Originally Posted by bobmcgov

Re: trysail vs. third reef. Understand the concern. Unless you are using a babystay that coincides with your lowered tack (where the leech tension acts like a backstay of sorts), there could be mast pumping. But doesn't a trysail have the same problem? Most I have seen share the main mast track or utilize a second luff groove, & they only hoist part way.

The try really needs its own track- from a practical standpoint it's almost impossible to get the main out and the try in when it's blowing snot.

With a light section stick, you probably need an inner forestay and runners to fly one.

[GeorgeB]

The problem with using a 3/16 line (Amsteel, Dynema or what ever) is point loading and chafe. Remember, that line will also be cinched around your sail. And the friction resulting from the cinching or the natural movement (however slight) when reefed, can’t be good for your sail on the long term. The messenger method of moving the reefing line is a pretty common practice amongst ocean racers and really isn’t that hard or difficult. You reeve while under sail (close hauled). The boom is stable and over the cockpit and it doesn’t take much time at all (if I can do it, you can do it too). It is a heck of a lot easier than launching a trysail (trust me!).