Read Right Wrong

[davidpm]

Last week I was in Mamaroneck Harbor for the first time helping a nice older gentleman sail his new boat for the first time.
The boat is a bullseye Bullseye Class Association
This boat is tricked out, professionally restored with every possible loving care.
The owner I was with has been sailing for over 75 years including significant racing of big boats. Now his dream is to sail this little 15' classic. I had the honor of taking him out for the first time under sail.

Here comes the lesson.
On our way out of the harbor we are nearing green "5" and he is steering to the right of it. I ask about the water and am assured that their is plenty.
On the way back we are taking the bouy to our port but I happen to check the chart plotter and notice that to the west of "5" there is 3' shallow spot.
I mention it to the captain because our track went right over the shallow spot. We only draw 3' 5" but still! He said red right returning, green, left leaving. I didn't argue with him but I knew something was wrong. I could see the track on the GPS.

Then it occurred to me, with red, right, returning yes but you can't reverse all three. Now both of us obviously know which side of the buoy to sail on, its not rocket science. It is just a lesson that sometimes your mind can play tricks on you and anyone can have temporary dyslexia.

On a smiler note I was with the director of a sailing program and he was checking out my sailing to see if he would let me captain a boat. I was steering he was handling the jib sheet. I called for a tack because of approaching rocks. He seemed to have trouble winching in the jib sheet. I knew what was wrong, he was wrapping the winch counter-clockwise but I didn't want to say anything after all he is the director.
After several tries and we only had 20' left I finally did suggest wrapping the other way. He was very embarrassed. Said that in over 20 years he didn't remember having his back to the bow before which caused him to get it reversed.

I wonder how may behaviors that are well learned are dependent on triggers that might in some situation be changed and cause us to forget how to perform a critical operation when needed.

[SEMIJim]

Originally Posted by davidpm

On our way out of the harbor we are nearing green "5" and he is steering to the right of it.

I interpret that as him steering to the right of of it, putting it on his port, which is wrong. He should have had it on his right (starboard), going out.

Originally Posted by davidpm

On the way back we are taking the bouy to our port ... He said red right returning, green, left leaving. I didn't argue with him but I knew something was wrong.

Well, yeah. If it's "red right returning," it's either "red left out" or "green right out." Neither of which is alliterative nor rhyming, which is why we don't memorize it that way.

Regarding somebody else getting a sheet on the winch wrong way around...

Originally Posted by davidpm

Said that in over 20 years he didn't remember having his back to the bow before which caused him to get it reversed.

Which is why I always teach everybody to always put their hand on the winch and give it a quick twist to confirm, before putting the sheet around it. I always do.

Was just discussing this last weekend with some fellow club members, over some post-race drinks in the cockpit of one of the boats, last weekend. It started with them talking about crew they'd had that couldn't seem to remember "clockwise" to save their souls. I mentioned my test-before-wrap method. They thought that was ridiculous. "Just have to remember clockwise." But it's all about muscle memory. If it becomes habit to quickly give the winch a manual test before wrapping the line around it, you don't have to think about which way it goes, you'll just automatically always get it right.

It's like this carabiner sitting in front of me. I have one of 'em nearby most of the time when I'm sitting at the computer or in front of the TV. It's got a triple-action locking gate. Requires a fair bit of one-handed manual dexterity to operate. I don't want to have to think about how it works when I'm hanging up there in the air.

Jim

[Tempest]

Clockwise is Clockwise, it doesn't matter which way one faces the winch.
He just had a brain-fart..... it happens.

The issue in the future will be that young sailors won't know what that means...having grown up with digital watches and cell phones...

[ffiill]

Tying a bowline knot is also a good example-I am used to doing it to create a loop in front of me with the lines coming towards me. A climbing friend is used to doing it with loop around him with the lines going away from him or around karabiner attached to him.
Try this out for youself.
Guarantee you find it almost impossible to reverse it unless its something you are used to !

[AboardIndigo]

Originally Posted by Tempest

Clockwise is Clockwise, it doesn't matter which way one faces the winch.
He just had a brain-fart..... it happens.

The issue in the future will be that young sailors won't know what that means...having grown up with digital watches and cell phones...

True, but most people don't stop, look, and think about clocks (or their rotations).

As Jim (I think) mentioned, the main factor for an experienced sailor is muscle memory. If you're normally facing forward, you're pulling the line straight back to you and onto the winch. If you do that facing aft, you'll wrap it counter-clockwise. To counteract the muscle memory, you need to pull the line across your body and onto the winch.

That's where giving the winch a spin as an additional process to deal with the anomoly forces the muscle memory to deal with both situations without additional thinking. Not that I do this. Maybe I'll try it and see if I like it.

[AboardIndigo]

Originally Posted by AboardIndigo

True, but most people don't stop, look, and think about clocks (or their rotations).

As Jim (I think) mentioned, the main factor for an experienced sailor is muscle memory. If you're normally facing forward, you're pulling the line straight back to you and onto the winch. If you do that facing aft, you'll wrap it counter-clockwise. To counteract the muscle memory, you need to pull the line across your body and onto the winch.

That's where giving the winch a spin as an additional process to deal with the anomoly forces the muscle memory to deal with both situations without additional thinking. Not that I do this. Maybe I'll try it and see if I like it.

On second thought, I probably won't. I frequently cross-sheet when I'm single-handing in a blow. When I go this route, I put a quarter wrap on the port winch the wrong way on purpose, leading it across the cockpit to the starboard winch for final wrapping. Obviously this doesn't apply when dealing with the starboard winch (it's the 'right' way in both cases, normal or cross-sheeting). I already have to think a little more anyway...

[Tempest]

Most people may not think about clocks or their rotations...but it's an essential part of sailing.....not only for sheets and halyards...but for weather...among other things....

[AboardIndigo]

Originally Posted by Tempest

Most people may not think about clocks or their rotations...but it's an essential part of sailing.....not only for sheets and halyards...but for weather...among other things....

You're changing the context of what I said. I suspect you're doing so because you shot from the lip the first time and are loathe to suggest that you didn't think it through.

It's okay, that's also human nature for some.

To wit, thinking about clocks is a part of many parts of sailing, yes. But it's not the overriding factor as to whether an experienced sailor gets the winch wraps right. Could it have been a brain fart? Sure. Was it a brain fart? Not likely. I know that I don't stop, look at my winch, and think 'clockwise man, clockwise' before I wrap the line.

Do you?

[SEMIJim]

Originally Posted by ffiill

Guarantee you find it almost impossible to reverse it unless its something you are used to !

I guess it's something I'm used to, then . I just grabbed one of my practice pieces of line and tied a bowline with the line coming toward me while I was walking back to the computer.

But...

When I was learning to tie the bowline, I practiced both styles (bitter end inside the loop and bitter end outside), from both sides (working end on right or left) and with the rope coming toward me or from behind, over and over and over again. There are some versions I tie often, others I tie rarely. So some I have to think about, others not. As for the direction the line's headed: Not a problem, as we use bowlines for both the foresheets and for the main halyard, so I'm regularly tying bowlines in lines both coming and going

I found, a couple of seasons, that spring came around and I'd forgotten some of the knots I didn't have to tie often the previous season. So now I make it a habit to keep bits of line around and idly tie and un-tie various useful knots. I even followed Brion Toss' example and keep a short piece of small stuff in my pocket.

Jim

[Tempest]

Originally Posted by AboardIndigo

You're changing the context of what I said. I suspect you're doing so because you shot from the lip the first time and are loathe to suggest that you didn't think it through.

It's okay, that's also human nature for some.


To wit, thinking about clocks is a part of many parts of sailing, yes. But it's not the overriding factor as to whether an experienced sailor gets the winch wraps right. Could it have been a brain fart? Sure. Was it a brain fart? Not likely. I know that I don't stop, look at my winch, and think 'clockwise man, clockwise' before I wrap the sheet.

Do you?

I don't know why you think you have to make personal attacks.....

No, I don't think about clockwise..because it's second nature.....facing forwards...backwards...doesn't matter....I couldn't imagine racing sailboats and having to spin the winch to find out which way to wrap the sheet.......