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pfile 10-05-2012 05:12 PM

Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Taking some of the great advice that I received here (with thanks) this my first season and I kept my Sabre 30 on a mooring in Port Washington, which was great.

I looked at hauling for this winter at Manhasset Bay Shipyard and talked with the manager George over the phone he was a nice guy.

I had my main halyard re-run by the guys at the rigging locker, yes I'm learning the hard way :)

MBSY is $54 per foot for winter storage.. wow.

I sailed over to City Island one afternoon and looked at Minneford Marina, where boatmax is, they had a winter storage rate of $33 per foot...

That's quite a price difference and I'm looking for some of your experiences guys to help swing me...

This will also be my first time hauling... oh and I didn't tell you about my incident with that bloody submerged rock in City Island... I will be doing some keel work.. :(

So first season, first grounding and lost the main halyard so far during my first solo...

Love it :)

pfile 10-05-2012 05:14 PM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Oh and this grounding was as I was motoring out of the mooring field and in view of several couples sitting in their cockpits enjoying sun downers who pointed out that "it's on the charts"


CalebD 10-05-2012 10:50 PM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Welcome to the wonderful world of boat ownership. I'll bet you thought that buying the boat was going to be the 'big' expense. As it turns out, not so much, it is the annual winter and summer fees that add up quick.
Yes, that is quite a price per foot difference between MBYC and Minnefords on CI. The price difference may not be the whole picture though. More and more boat yards do not allow (read: like) you to paint your own bottom so they will charge you for that. Some yards allow very little DIY work or outside contractors (without a cut for themselves). So it is incumbent on you to figure out what MBYC and Minnefords will allow you to do, or not, and factor that into the price.

Winter storage is expensive. It can be less expensive the farther you go from NYC though. There are places up the Hudson (Stony Point has a boat yard) and places farther out on LI (Port Jeff, Mt. Sinai) and places farther up the CT coast (if that is where you are).

The absolute, most cheapest way to keep a boat is to join a 'working' boat club like the Hempstead Harbor Club (not a Yacht club). It is a club where the members must work a certain amount of time above and beyond their dues. Their winter storage and summer rates are usually much cheaper then what you would pay at most boat yards, marinas or yacht cubs. There are not many of these types of clubs around though.
Here are some theoretical numbers: if it cost you $2K or less per year for summer AND winter storage at a club it would end up costing you about $10K over 5 years (plus membership fees for each year).
If it cost you $3K per year for summer PLUS another $2K for winter storage somewhere you would be paying about $25K over 5 years.
The difference equals a lot of boat bucks.

Regarding rocks around City Island. Yup, they are on the charts. Most of them anyway. The CT shoreline of the LI Sound is generally more rocky then the LI shoreline. Have you found the Steppingstone Rocks yet? I sailed right over them once and all that happened was we got an air horn from someone at the King's Point Academy. My boat only draws 3'6" with the center board up and it must have been high tide.

Welcome to the wonderful world of boat ownership.

Plumbean 10-06-2012 12:07 AM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Caleb is correct. You need to do some digging to make sure you know what the all in cost is for the haul out. Some places charge separately for a lot things, and others lump it all together. When I'm shopping I usually create a spreadsheet to try and get to an apples to apples comparison.

George is a good guy. I kept my boat at MBSY last winter and just sent in my contract for this winter. It is a little more expensive than what I paid at Glen Cove Marina, but after the Evil Empire (er, I mean Brewers) took that place over their prices went up such that I'd rather keep the old girl at MBSY, which is 10 minutes from my house.

FYI, you can't do your own bottom paint at MBSY (or most places for that matter), so that is extra.

Oh yeah, and that purchase price you paid was really just a license fee that permits you to spend money and time on the boat ... ;)

Marcel D 10-06-2012 12:11 AM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
We keep our boat at Port Sindey BC and for a 34 foot slip is 540.00 per month ouch. But we love to sail and the marina is very nice.

pfile 10-10-2012 12:42 PM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the help!

I did speak with George at MBSY and he told me about not being able to paint at the yard but was open to me working on my boat (and lord knows there's a lot of work to do :)

Plumbean, funny about the purchase price just being a license to spend more money!

Caleb, thanks again for your help. I will check out the Hempstead Harbor Club. I'm also going to call around City Island places.

The rocks that I found.... "Big Tom Rock" - from Active Captain.

Latitude: 40°50.101'N
Longitude: 073°47.337'W

pfile 10-11-2012 03:42 AM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
By the way, I took her out this past Saturday on my own. Most of my friends live in Manhattan and don't get the concept of how much fun this is... don't want to take the trek out to Port Washington on a weekend.

I loved it, even if I was on my own and doing less than 3 knots, I just kept looking at the other guys points of sail and trying to mimic it and trim accordingly :-)

My problems, getting the bloody main up, the battens keep catching on the lazy jacks, and also one of the slugs decided to drop out of the mast channel.

I head up as best I can but it's a bitch to get the main up on your own, it needs to be guided by hand so the battens don't snag on the lazy jack lines. Plus it's a bitch to get it up. I did spray the mast channel with that lubricant (the $30 buck harken stuff..) but still. Maybe I should use a winch handle but I'm scared of ripping something...

One thing that I learned is that the main should go up first. So many people told me to use the roller furler, it's wrong. I can't tack with just the head sail. I've learned from here, main first and last.

Anyway it was great with just the main and I got 5 knots (on the GPS) at times, I used the traveler and the main sheet to control over power.

Eventually I rolled out the genoa but I could not get a handle on it, seems like I can't work out how far aft or forward I should move the genoa block.

Also, I need gloves, my hands where torn up.

The Sabre seems so forgiving of me making rookie mistakes. Self tailing is king here.

I wish I could get better sail trim with the genny and main up, I think the genny is 120.

Also the main slug at the end is not slotted into the boom, I can't seem to get the outhaul to work..

I only did the basic keel course out of liberty landing with offshore sailing (highly recommend them by the way, it was excellent) but decided the money they wanted for the next level courses would be best invested in buying a boat and.... making all these mistakes..:)

Buy a boat, go sailing, you will learn quickly

pfile 10-11-2012 04:00 AM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Oh and another thing that I love, when I get my sails all trimmed up, she just sails along on the same tack for ages. I could sit back and enjoy the ride. It takes a long while before she heads up or falls off. I love it.

chef2sail 10-11-2012 10:13 AM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Sabres are nice boats.

Invest in EZ Jacks, they can be deployed from the cockpit, and when you get anchored or moored you pull them abck to the mast and inder the sail (or cover) so they are not in your way when you raise you main the next time you are out or need to. Also make sure you are heading up into the wind directly when raising the main.

If you are buy yourself and dont have an autopilot set the pedestal wheel brake and put the sail up in a p;rotected non windy area if possible.



CalebD 10-11-2012 04:05 PM

Re: Winter Storage - City Island or Port Washington?
Sabre sailboats are pretty highly regarded so you've got a good one there.
As Dave suggested, you need to be able to "hide" or stow the lazy jacks when raising the main sail. See if you can find the control lines for your Lazy Jacks - you should be able to loosen them. If not, consider replacing the Lazy Jack sail control lines with bungee cord line. This way the Lazy Jacks can be stretched up to the mast and fixed there so they are out of the way of the sail when raising.

If your main sail has those plastic sail slides to hold them in the slot I can tell you that they do wear down and will pop out of the sail track at the most inconvenient times. You can get new sail slides from Sailrite (and other places) which may require a little sewing to attach them to your sail. If you don't have one I'll recommend the Speedy Stitcher kit: Speedy Stitcher Sewing Awl Kit - Online Video Instructions for the Sewing Awl

Sail slide (3/4"): Slide Nylon Internal Flat 3/4"
It is quite important to get the exact size to fit your mast track.

Getting from NY to Port Washington is an easy train ride. Less easy by car.
Which marina are you keeping your boat in now? Most of the marinas there are about 1 mile away from the train station.

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