6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea - Page 18 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Vessels Lost, Missing, or in Danger
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree72Likes
Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #171  
Old 10-25-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 39
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
lavidanueva is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

We are fighting against basic ignorance about longevity at sea. John Glennie survived on the East side of New Zealand with three crew mates for 119 days. He says he would have made it a lot longer. There is a lot of rain in the spring in the Tasman, plus plenty of fish to catch. I don't want to imply survival is easy, but it is feasible. Sailing Savoir Faire: Ralph Baird Talks About Hopes For Nina on NZ National Radio
Quick reply to this message
  #172  
Old 10-25-2013
oceangirl's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 223
Thanks: 36
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 7
oceangirl is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

I agree, the survival rates in these situations, goes up not down as years go by as technology, education, better resources aboard increase. They may very well be alive, and until such evidence presents itself, we should assume they are.

I signed the petition. Let me know if there if a particular person I can write in the gov, chaps my hide they are giving you slack. Being found, after this time frame of being lost at sea, is not out of the realm of possibilities.

God bless
wavedancer38 likes this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

~~Ocean Girl~~
~~Mrs. Rain Dog~~
1989 Pacific Seacraft Crealock 34 Hull# 142

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Quick reply to this message
  #173  
Old 10-25-2013
MarkofSeaLife's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,472
Thanks: 29
Thanked 92 Times in 75 Posts
Rep Power: 5
MarkofSeaLife is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Its one of those unusual situations where any discussion to the contrary appears disingenuous.
Dfok and capta like this.
__________________
Sea Life
Notes on a Circumnavigation:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Quick reply to this message
  #174  
Old 10-25-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 39
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
lavidanueva is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Thanks, all for posting and commenting. Every one knows, including the families, that the sailors on the Nina are fighting long odds. However, those discussions do little to assist in the search process. There is a real possibility the Nina is afloat and the sailors alive. That is based upon facts not made clear in most of the press, as well as true histories of people who have survived New Zealand winters stranded on the sea.

Every sailor will benefit from the research being done in the search for the 7 sailors. Texas Equusearch has gathered an incredible team of volunteer NASA scientists, fluid hydrologists, geophysicists, computer scientists, and an army of volunteers to look for the Nina. Use of satellites to search for sailors places no lives at risk and could save huge dollars as the technology develops. Learning how to search for images, get photographs quickly, run accurate drift models is all part of the process. The various RCC organizations are strapped trying to keep up with their own workload, so the efforts by Equusearch are invaluable.

Your support of this effort, then, could save your life, or the lives of someone you know. It is a process, the answers are still being worked upon, but what a noble cause. We ask you to make positive comments and to support us in our quest to bring #s7s sailors home. The families do read the boards and say they are very grateful for your ideas and your help.

Tim
wavedancer38 likes this.
Quick reply to this message
  #175  
Old 10-25-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Wayne, PA
Posts: 222
Thanks: 3
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Rep Power: 5
Dfok is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceangirl View Post
I signed the petition. Let me know if there if a particular person I can write in the gov, chaps my hide they are giving you slack. Being found, after this time frame of being lost at sea, is not out of the realm of possibilities.

God bless
Once into the sea are you still American or Brit? When do you become a simple human in need of help? Should all technology be beamed to a splinter of a splinter of the oceans because Americans or Brits are lost? 300 African migrants died trying to reach Italy in the last week, 700 or 800 refugees ( as of 10/25/2013 - check in the morning) were rescued by the Italian Coast Guard. Broken up boatloads of Haitians are rescued or die almost daily off Florida. New Jersey fishermen and sailors have kept the local US Coast Guard bases busy. I suspect the CG has not had much of a break on any of the US coasts in recent times.
I support every effort made to rescue the wayward or hapless mariner within reason, but as a taxpayer it "chaps my hide" to chase apparent ghosts six months gone, especially when they are half a world away.
If "God" were blessing every voyage would any boat go missing?
"6 Americans, 1 Brit" = 7 more souls gone to the sea.
Honor their path. If they come back celebrate their miracle.
MarkofSeaLife likes this.
Quick reply to this message
  #176  
Old 10-25-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 39
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
lavidanueva is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Thanks Dfok,

A lot of people don't know, the Nina 7, as some of us call them, are not millionaire sailors, but normal folk like you and me. Some of them are from humble means. Even the boat's owners worked for years, several months on and a few months off, living their cruising dreams.

Yes, of course, we grieve for the loss to of all life, including those desperate for the most basic of opportunities, to feed their starving families. Technology must be advanced by someone. It is the luck of the families and the skill of the team assembled, including Texas Equusearch, that places the Nina search at the forefront of this breaking technology. However, certainly, it will be applied to other searches, including searches for New Zealand sailors and sailors from many countries, including those from impoverished nations.

Satellite searches have been done before in the U.S. However, to our knowledge, never have they been done in the Tasman Sea for private boats. Hence, the significance is to sailors from that region who may brave one of the toughest stretches of water known to man. Ultimately, we hope the technology develops enough to be used around the world for all people.

Thanks for your points.

Tim
Quick reply to this message
  #177  
Old 10-26-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 39
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
lavidanueva is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Everyone is entitled to their point of view, brother. You make some great points which we should address. All of us, including ALL the people with Texas Equusearch, are unpaid volunteers. Our biggest expense is for search aircraft. No one is making any money on this effort and many have donated over 1,000 hours and a lot of money. Funds come from the community.

Digital Globe has trained satellites all over the world to help people in distress. They recently used the Tomnod program in the Colorado floods, but they also go to very remote places to help those in need. As I understand it, the satellites don't change orbit, they change angle of photography. They are not taking many pics of the Tasman Sea while flying over it. I can't think of a better use for these private (not government) satellites than saving lives.

I am a sailor with my own lost at sea story. When I got into trouble I really wanted someone to help, but far outside of radio range, and not willing to pop the EPIRB and lose the investment I worked my life to have, I stuck it out. For me, it was only 7 days. I was stuck there in gale conditions with a broken rudder and crew spaced out on sea sickness drugs. As a sailor I have learned I must do everything I can to save myself. However, if I were aboard the Nina, I would want everything possible done to help. This new technology will eventually make it more cost effective and not place lives at risk giving that help. This is simple common sense.

They held a eulogy for John Glennie. It is not for me to play God and declare people dead.

Despite the most exhaustive search in the history of New Zealand, not one scrap of evidence was found showing the Nina sank. Extensive shore line searches were performed. There is a very strong possibility the Nina is up and the crew in good health. There is lots of rain water in the Tasman and lots of fish. Fortunately, in the search team, there is a lot of faith, as well.

Thanks for the comments, perhaps we can agree to disagree.

Tim
wavedancer38 and ShoalFinder like this.
Quick reply to this message
  #178  
Old 10-26-2013
hellosailor's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10,799
Thanks: 2
Thanked 97 Times in 94 Posts
Rep Power: 10
hellosailor has a spectacular aura about hellosailor has a spectacular aura about
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

DigitalGlobe apparently bought up the Tomnod operation. They also list having 11 satellites, first listing says it has sub-meter resolution and repeats the entire planet every 3 days. (Which probably means the satellite is in a north-south polar orbit, and allowing the earth to slowly rotate under it, unlike the ISS or other spacecraft that are more or less orbiting over the equator and zipping around the earth all the time.)

Given that the Nina departed a known port at a known date, that should mean DG and Tomnod can start with that place and date, identify the boat, and unless cloud cover stops them, track it from there on until at some point it either disappears, or is located.

Not an easy job, but actually a fairly simple one given the resources they say they can provide. No need for government or military resources at all, when there are private ones of the same caliber.

Has such a project been started then? Or has any imagery of Nina before she left port been confirmed ?
Quick reply to this message
  #179  
Old 10-26-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 39
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
lavidanueva is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Good thinking! Yes, archival footage has been checked. Nothing has been found which tracks this boat. Unless specifically tasked, the satellites don't shoot photos.

I found a photo on Google Earth of what I think is the Nina in Whangerai, NZ in December, 2012.

I can't think of a better use of US government satellites than to help US and British sailors. One day, we hope governments strapped for cash will be able to request the same of the US government which will make all sailors safer.

We all understand the old thinking in SAR at SEA searches. After so much effort, you are on your own, unless you happen to be the son of a senator or high ranking politician, and then no holds are barred.

This technology promises great advances to give sailors every chance possible when all goes wrong no matter who they are. It takes a case like this to advance the way the technology is used, which is why the families and TES have assembled ALL VOLUNTEER NASA scientists, fluid hydrologists, geophysicists, computer scientists, media people (like me), SAR experts, satellite photo reviewers and many more. One day, that which is taking a league of people to do now can be done fast with image recognition and friendly cooperation by governments. Someone in the Sailnet community will benefit.

Right now, we need the support of the sailing community to help put pressure on the US State Department, which, rather than offering help, asked for dental records. If nothing else, I personally hope we can at least prevent this indignity while an active search is in process.

Thanks for making great points and thanks to this wonderful community for supporting the search for the American treasure, the 1928 schooner, Nina, and her crew.

The enclosed photo is from Google Earth, likely a digital globe photo, of what I think is the Nina in Whangarei, NZ in December of 2012. Our tomnod images are not generally as clear. You can help us search for the Nina HERE.

wavedancer38 likes this.

Last edited by lavidanueva; 10-26-2013 at 03:18 AM. Reason: PHOTOGRAPH
Quick reply to this message
  #180  
Old 10-26-2013
wavedancer38's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 158
Thanks: 7
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 6
wavedancer38 is on a distinguished road
Re: 6 Americans, 1 Brit vanish at sea

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dfok View Post
Please Tim, do not thank me. Let us not misunderstand each other. I totally disagree with you and all you have posted thus far.
US Government assets (if they exist in the Tasman Sea) should not be subverted for a private search.
Texas Equusearch is a couple guys with horses (in Texas) and a PR team....what's up with the sudden concern about Texan's abroad and alost in boats?
Would missing Oakies or Arkansans or Haitians or Libiyans merit changing the orbits of low level US satellites?
Would you Texans demand swerving a satellite for a lost mariner in the Bronx? Off Massachusetts? Swivel a bit to cover Nova Scotia?
I don't think so.
Tim - in you I do not sense a sailor's soul. Sailors let the dead be dead, counsel families to be at peace.
Some - not the sailors - will never let souls rest as long as there is a cent to be made from the memory or the bones ( or all the better - lack of bones!). Where once were persons today lies profit.
Do not thank me, count me among the disgusted with your efforts.
(and there I was trying to be so polite...)
Ouch. God forbid you ever need help in your life. You can count me out.
__________________
Wavedancer
Morgan 384
Baltimore, MD
Quick reply to this message
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hi from a Brit abroad! britmick Introduce Yourself 1 10-21-2012 11:41 PM
Hi from Brit Newbie Sailorsteve Introduce Yourself 2 07-25-2012 12:46 PM
FELLOW AMERICANS SHIMSHON General Discussion (sailing related) 9 09-21-2001 05:08 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:48 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.