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  #561  
Old 07-17-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

back to iridium and how they have gone the way of cell phone providers another latitude update here:

Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude

take away rebel heart, the whole debacle, the kids, the bad condition of the boat, inexperience or false experience, whatever

take it all out of the situation and look at these 3 points being made

THIS

is unacceptable for an emergency phone provider...it HAS happened to others and its inexcuseable

I think we need to separate issues here...they are unrelated in essence but in RH case they did become a factor...

Im avoiding any comment whatsoever about the lawsuit, how fit or not they were as captains and crew , parenting etc...

the last point made by richard is the one that most impacts me(a satellite phone SHOULD be able to be used NO MATTEER WHAT THE CHARGES in an emergency, it can be dealt with AFTER but in order to save lives there has to be NO QUESTION WHATSOEVER that it will work.

in my limited experience using these phones over 10 years back and most recently about 6 years ago this was the case.

what has happened these last few years, months days?
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Last edited by christian.hess; 07-17-2014 at 12:48 PM.
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  #562  
Old 07-17-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puddin'_Tain View Post
I'll say it again, very little kids can get very sick very fast. Going offshore with a toddler was mistake number one.......
You and I would have made the same decision not to take our young children on this passage. However, in the extreme, you have to be critical of every parent that decides to even have a child across half the planet that has nearly zero access to medical care. Judging someone, just because they come from a first world country doesn't seem entirely fair. In the end, it's the parent's decision and only their decision to make. Up to a point. That point is highly subjective.
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  #563  
Old 07-17-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
You and I would have made the same decision not to take our young children on this passage. However, in the extreme, you have to be critical of every parent that decides to even have a child across half the planet that has nearly zero access to medical care. Judging someone, just because they come from a first world country doesn't seem entirely fair. In the end, it's the parent's decision and only their decision to make. Up to a point. That point is highly subjective.
I totally agree with you here Minne. What's intriguing to me about this case - in general - is the seeming expectation that a satphone would/should infallibly provide access to "first-world quality medical services/consultation" regardless of location or situation the user has put himself/herself into.

This is the flip-side issue of this case in my opinion -i.e. - what IS a "reasonable expectation" for what a satphone provider owes you in regards to these grayer areas of communication beyond a simple call for rescue?

Given the nature of offshore passage making, uninterrupted "first-world quality medical services/consultation" certainly doesn't seem to be a reasonable expectation. But it seems to be what the case is hinged on.
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  #564  
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

I agree, the lawsuit has no merit, unless there was an explicit guarantee I'm unaware of. However, losing the sat phone was why they lost their boat, the sat company just doesn't accrue liability for it.
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  #565  
Old 07-18-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
I agree, the lawsuit has no merit, unless there was an explicit guarantee I'm unaware of. However, losing the sat phone was why they lost their boat, the sat company just doesn't accrue liability for it.
Well, I'm not so sure that's a foregone conclusion.

These folks pointed the finger all over the place (except at themselves) giving inconsistent and illogical reasons for abandoning RH. The sick kid came in and out of the picture for awhile there.

Moreover, if a 1 year old really was that sick in the middle of the ocean, wouldn't a doctor recommend abandoning ship and seeking medical treatment anyway? I mean, it's not like a doctor can reach through the sat phone and diagnose and render treatment.

Lastly, I've said it before and I'll say it again. My read on the whole situation was that it was driven by Charlotte wanting Off The F'in Boat. The sick kid, the broken sat phone, the leaky boat, was all pretext for the ultimate desire. Believe me, if I was defending the sat phone company, this would be a large part of the defense, and there has been plenty of evidence to support the theory.
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  #566  
Old 07-18-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Charlie Doane has dug into this a bit more, his post is well worth reading... Clarifies some issues, but muddies the waters in some others...

REBEL HEART: Lawsuit Against Sat-Phone Provider | Sailfeed

For those who have been ragging on Iridium:

Quote:

Attorney Gilleon: We have no evidence that Iridium was at fault in any way and furthermore would like to thank Iridium for being as forthcoming as possible in helping us to understand what happened to Eric’s account as it was handled by Whenever LLC.
One of the more interesting conclusions I draw from reading Charlie between the lines, is that for Eric to have continued the voyage himself without the use of a satphone or EPIRB might have presented a risk sufficient to warrant abandoning REBEL HEART... I'd love to hear what someone like Robin Knox-Johnston, or Webb Chiles - or anyone else who ever sailed across an ocean without an EPIRB or sat phone - would have to say about that... :-)

Anyway, it's nice to know that Charlie is still praying that I'll never have to abandon a boat offshore... :-)
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  #567  
Old 08-06-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Children have a habit of getting sick in all kinds of places: hotels, boats, in-laws house, in-laws's boat, the mall, etc.

This family sounds like they were prepared for all other contingencies. We have met other live-aboard families with happy, well-adjusted, healthy kids. I am sure those kids all got a cold, stomach viruses, chicken pox, etc, at one time or another.

Take the child away? Parents irresponsible? Really???

The parents should get the child well and get right back on the boat if it can be repaired and go on with their plan. Their children's lives will be that much richer.
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Children have a habit of getting sick in all kinds of places: hotels, boats, in-laws house, in-laws's boat, the mall, etc.

This family sounds like they were prepared for all other contingencies.
I'm sorry - but being able to take care of your kid when he/she is sick is pretty important.

In light of everything I've seen in my research, I have lost complete respect for these people.

They should have stayed home and taken care of their kids. Period.
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Originally Posted by dinghygoddess View Post
The parents should get the child well and get right back on the boat if it can be repaired and go on with their plan. Their children's lives will be that much richer.
You are missing a very large part of this story.

For one, the boat sunk to the bottom of the Pacific some 900 miles off the coast of Mexico while the family was taken back to California on a Navy ship.

If you happened to miss that detail, you really don't know what you are talking about.
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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You are missing a very large part of this story.

For one, the boat sunk to the bottom of the Pacific some 900 miles off the coast of Mexico while the family was taken back to California on a Navy ship.

If you happened to miss that detail, you really don't know what you are talking about.
I do not recall that it sunk. It was either just abandon or was scuttled.

While you are correct that the previous poster missed an important point that the boat is not recoverable, I think it's also important to note that they voluntarily stepped off to save their kid. As they should have.
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