eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Vessels Lost, Missing, or in Danger
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree6Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 05-25-2014
svHyLyte's Avatar
Old as Dirt!
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa Bay Area
Posts: 2,548
Thanks: 11
Thanked 84 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 6
svHyLyte is on a distinguished road
eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

For the aficionados/proponents of electronic navigation that eschew keeping a back-up on "paper charts" and such "out dated" technology, the demise of the yacht Seaquel is a cautionary tale. See (click on) Seaquel's Final Chapter.





A word to the wise? Think about it.
christian.hess likes this.
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 05-25-2014
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
vikingthunder is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

I am not sure that it is so much a Cautionary tale about Electronic navigation equipment, so much as it is a cautionary tale about redundant backups, and also on the idea of using something like an Ipad as a primary navigation device.

I cannot imagine anyone thinking it was safe to use anything as a primary Navigation device that was not Dedicated to Navigation only. A dedicated Chartplotter/MFD, with an Ipod as a backup, would have not allowed such a thing to happen.

If anything, this could be a lesson in Prudent navigation. Had the Skipper turned out to sea when his Ipad stopped working properly, and stayed far from shore while getting it working again, he would have likely had no issues.

As it was, it would appear he was out in a place of which he was unawares, without having any real redundancy in navigation, using only an Ipad, and not keeping his fuel tanks topped up caused him to push when he should not have. Many mistakes stacked on top of one another ended in catastrophe.

We can all consider him lucky that all of his crew are safe and sound.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 05-25-2014
hellosailor's Avatar
Plausible Deniability
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 10,418
Thanks: 1
Thanked 74 Times in 72 Posts
Rep Power: 10
hellosailor has a spectacular aura about hellosailor has a spectacular aura about
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

Sounds more like a warning about blind skippers.

The skipper himself says it was all his fault, and if he'd been able to SEE, he wouldn't have gotten into that situation.

That wreck had nothing to do with nav systems or electronics, it was a skipper sailing without adequate knowledge of where he was.

Same thing could happen to any solo sailor who just takes short catnaps...and oversleeps once. You can't close your eyes when there's pointy stuff within range of the boat, period.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 05-25-2014
MarkofSeaLife's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,972
Thanks: 25
Thanked 39 Times in 36 Posts
Rep Power: 4
MarkofSeaLife is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

How are paper charts going to help?


Quote:

Berg, who is totally blind.
Disabled and physically challenged people are allowed to partake in the world. In fact its behoven on us luckier people to give them a helping hand.

I am typing this on an Ipad and I think they are a bloody stupid kids toy. Great for portability, but its nothing like a real computer. Ipad a toy that Apple still thing they own after you take it from their shop... Never letting you be in total control. Its a walking lump of malicious code that spys and tries to control your computer life.


Anyway, if he was sighted, and below looking at paper charts he may still have made the same error.

Quote:
"I should have just said, 'Hang a hard left', until we sorted things out, but I didn't. It was totally my screw-up." Before they could find a software solution, they heard the sound of surf crashing and they knew they were in trouble.
Thats CDF if you get locationally disorientated wether on Paper charts, or proper charts you should turn to safe waters till you got it sorted out.

Mark
Slayer likes this.
__________________
Sea Life
Notes on a Circumnavigation:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 05-25-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 666
Thanks: 0
Thanked 17 Times in 17 Posts
Rep Power: 4
Frogwatch is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

I,m not too impressed with the iPad as primary nav tool. I'd use it but would use gps and paper charts as my primary nav tool.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 05-26-2014
kp44
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 5
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Elewese is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

Just to stop the speculation going on out there from those not in the know. John had a complete state of the art Simrad navigation system,GPS, chart plotter, radar and AIS which interfaced with his Ipad. The Ipad was a repeater used in the cockpit along with his iphone as cockpit backup. It all worked seamlessly together. We used it in the local Channel Islands without a hitch.

John is an accomplished sailor and I have trusted him and his judgment on many occasions at sea. He is a better sailor than most sighted people and he remains my first choice in crew aboard our KP44.

As in any accident it is never one thing that causes it. In this case there were several issues which had to be dealt with which lead to the accident. It happened and there is no going back.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 05-26-2014
Dean101's Avatar
Life is a wild ride!
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 387
Thanks: 6
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 4
Dean101 is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elewese View Post
Just to stop the speculation going on out there from those not in the know. John had a complete state of the art Simrad navigation system,GPS, chart plotter, radar and AIS which interfaced with his Ipad. The Ipad was a repeater used in the cockpit along with his iphone as cockpit backup. It all worked seamlessly together. We used it in the local Channel Islands without a hitch.

John is an accomplished sailor and I have trusted him and his judgment on many occasions at sea. He is a better sailor than most sighted people and he remains my first choice in crew aboard our KP44.

As in any accident it is never one thing that causes it. In this case there were several issues which had to be dealt with which lead to the accident. It happened and there is no going back.
Was the Simrad system what the article was referring to when it said "The built-in chartplotter had a system that displayed NOAA charts, but Berg says that proved inadequate."? I thought the iNavX was an Apple application and I assumed as I read the article that the iPad was being used as the primary nav method. Are you saying it was just repeating what the Simrad was doing?

Another thing I'm curious about is the usefulness of NOAA charts around Hawaii. I would not think they would be inadequate in that area of the world.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 05-26-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,397
Thanks: 0
Thanked 113 Times in 101 Posts
Rep Power: 4
JonEisberg will become famous soon enough
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

The cautionary tale in this one, for me, is the simple loss of Situational Awareness - which I believe has become more common and easily accomplished these days, with most boats becoming increasingly complex, and navigation typically reliant on electronic gizmos that so easily 'enable' one to become dangerously distracted when a glitch arises... A broken point on a #2 lead pencil, or a sticky pair of parallel rules, was far less likely to result in the sort of loss of situational awareness than that which can attend having to troubleshoot or reboot a balky computer or chartplotter... :-)

Classic example of EAL Flight 401 Syndrome, nothing more, nothing less... Don't allow yourself to become dangerously preoccupied with a minor problem, to the point of forgetting you still have to fly the damn plane, or sail the freakin' boat...

MedSailor, Dean101 and oysterman23 like this.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 05-26-2014
svHyLyte's Avatar
Old as Dirt!
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa Bay Area
Posts: 2,548
Thanks: 11
Thanked 84 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 6
svHyLyte is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
Sounds more like a warning about blind skippers.

The skipper himself says it was all his fault, and if he'd been able to SEE, he wouldn't have gotten into that situation.

That wreck had nothing to do with nav systems or electronics, it was a skipper sailing without adequate knowledge of where he was.

Same thing could happen to any solo sailor who just takes short catnaps...and oversleeps once. You can't close your eyes when there's pointy stuff within range of the boat, period.
The owner had a sighted crewman aboard upon whom he was entirely dependent, particularly near shore. His taking "responsibility" for the loss of the yacht is a noble but rather hollow gesture. They were sailing in an area with which they were entirely unfamiliar and had evidently not acquainted themselves. They were dependent upon an electronic device that allowed them to proceed without maintaining any practical situation/positional awareness. Had they studied a chart beforehand and kept it open on their nav table or in their cockpit, when the electronics went down there would have been no real issue. Instead they fiddled around with their malfunctioning electronics while they stood into danger/disaster. Defending and offering apologias for the owner's choices may seem "kinder" but it/they dilute the object lesson others might take from the event. Hindsight's always 20/20. Foresight gets one a lot farther.

FWIW...
christian.hess likes this.
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."

Last edited by svHyLyte; 05-26-2014 at 11:04 AM. Reason: Correct typo.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 05-26-2014
new dad!
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: el salvador
Posts: 3,214
Thanks: 78
Thanked 124 Times in 120 Posts
Rep Power: 1
christian.hess is on a distinguished road
Re: eNav Warning--Seaquel's Final Chapter

so what he got popups or something on that damn ipod? couldnt load his nav page no matter what?

hate those things

a chart and a gps coordinate from a simple handhled done, simple

x2 on 20 20 hindsight though...
__________________
1973 Islander 36 "resto" ALMOST there, and ready to SAIL!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Warning warning advertising for paying crew piclarke Crew Wanted/Available 55 01-17-2014 05:22 PM
Chapter 1: Our first cruise TheWollard General Discussion (sailing related) 19 04-02-2013 09:20 AM
the next chapter realfstkid Introduce Yourself 2 11-16-2012 09:52 AM
UK. Repeat warning: Check your White Collision Warning Flares now, don’t risk serious injury @ BYM Sailing News NewsReader News Feeds 0 04-13-2006 08:15 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:41 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.