HMS Bounty in trouble... - Page 137 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Vessels Lost, Missing, or in Danger
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree718Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1361  
Old 12-16-2012
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,191
Thanks: 21
Thanked 98 Times in 81 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bountydaughter View Post
...
This situation has not been criticized by all of the mariner community. Not ALL tall ship captains have spoken out against his decision. The ones who do speak against him are the ones that get the attention. We can agree to disagree but I do not think that one decision, regardless of the outcome defines a person as reckless, foolish or egotistical. No one will ever know what was exactly going through his mind when he made that decision but I can tell you that it was a thought out decision based on experience. As a man and a captain this is how Robin was.
I have edited the last post (when you where posting this one) adding a comment basically to say that i am very sorry for not share with you the same views on this matter. Again, I am truly sorry for your loss and I will try not to reply to anything you say unless you refer directly to what was said already on this thread.

One last comment to say that if not all Tall ship Captains made public statements about Bounty's captain to sail out of port to an hurricane, all that talked showed disapproval about that decision. If that was a debatable decision it would be natural that many would come forward defending Bounty's Captain decision. After all he was one of them and nobody likes to see "one of us" unjustifiably blamed.

Regards

Paulo
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1362  
Old 12-16-2012
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: PA
Posts: 6
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
YukonJack is on a distinguished road
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bountydaughter View Post
That reporter was from a small public access channel in a small town in Maine. If this incident would not have happened very few people would have actually seen that interview. That interview was not going to press or to social media. Dozens of people would have seen it if this did not happen, most certainly not thousands. The reporter decided to post it to social media after the incident. You cannot judge Robin as boastful from that one interview. It is unfortunate that this reporter felt the need to use this tragedy to publicize himself and all opinions are being based from this one silly interview.
I can tell you judging the man and the captain are not two separate things. I don't know how you feel qualified to judge him as a captain. Yes, this decision went horribly wrong. I will never deny that but people make decisions and sometimes they do not go as we had planned or thought. This does not take away from his capabilities as a captain.
This situation has not been criticized by all of the mariner community. Not ALL tall ship captains have spoken out against his decision. The ones who do speak against him are the ones that get the attention. We can agree to disagree but I do not think that one decision, regardless of the outcome defines a person as reckless, foolish or egotistical. No one will ever know what was exactly going through his mind when he made that decision but I can tell you that it was a thought out decision based on experience. As a man and a captain this is how Robin was.

It is my respectful opinion that your dad made a very bad decision to sail in the direction of Hurricane Sandy.

This was the storm of the century. It was not the case that he was caught by surprise. A captain's responsibility is to also take many things into consideration of a known event-- his ship, his crew He must have known the abuse from the sea that the BOUNTY would have been subjected to. Would she be able to handle it ? He was also sailing with what would be considered a light crew for any Tall Ship under normal conditions.

I really do not mean to sound harsh, but these are my opinions.

I am really sorry for the loss of your dad. I know what that is like.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1363  
Old 12-16-2012
TakeFive's Avatar
If it's blowin' I'm goin'
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 2,661
Thanks: 6
Thanked 52 Times in 49 Posts
Rep Power: 6
TakeFive will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
...One last comment to say that if not all Tall ship Captains made public statements about Bounty's captain to sail out of port to an hurricane, all that talked showed disapproval about that decision...
See what I mean about people rolling back their prior statements?

But I think that even your revised statement may be inaccurate. Like much speculation and chat room gossip, you are a victim of sampling bias. It is likely that there were some who spoke less critically of the captain, but it was less "newsworthy" so their statements did not go viral like the critical statements.

It's easy to sit at your computer with 20/20 hindsight and say the captain made the wrong decision. Since there were fatalities, it is clear that it was a bad decision. It goes without saying, which is why it is not necessary to repeat it and repeat it and repeat it...

What I am interested in hearing is what were the facts and prior experiences that led to his decision. The fact that the USCG forced Bounty out of port as Hurricane Andrew was approaching is one of those facts that can put this decision into a broader context.
Brewgyver and Bountydaughter like this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Formerly posted as "RhythmDoctor"
1998 Catalina 250WK Take Five (at Anchorage Marina, Essington, on the Delaware River)
1991 15' Trophy (Lake Wallenpaupack)
1985 14' Phantom (Lake Wallenpaupack)

Last edited by TakeFive; 12-16-2012 at 04:27 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1364  
Old 12-16-2012
TakeFive's Avatar
If it's blowin' I'm goin'
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 2,661
Thanks: 6
Thanked 52 Times in 49 Posts
Rep Power: 6
TakeFive will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by YukonJack View Post
...This was the storm of the century...
I do not debate that is was a very big storm. But I always roll my eyes over this "storm of the century" crap. I've heard the same thing about a dozen times so far this century. That's newsroom hype, not weather jargon.

Sandy was a huge storm of unprecedented size. Its intensity was not as great as other recent storms. Some of the facts that have emerged do seem to give credence to the argument that Bounty had survived more intense conditions in the past. As we try to speculate on what happened, these mitigating facts may shed some light on the captain's thinking at the time.
Brewgyver likes this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Formerly posted as "RhythmDoctor"
1998 Catalina 250WK Take Five (at Anchorage Marina, Essington, on the Delaware River)
1991 15' Trophy (Lake Wallenpaupack)
1985 14' Phantom (Lake Wallenpaupack)

Last edited by TakeFive; 12-16-2012 at 04:28 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1365  
Old 12-16-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,011
Thanks: 29
Thanked 55 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameswilson29 View Post
Thanks for the heads up, I edited one of my comments...
Editing a comment is disingenuine. You made it already just because you unwrite it does not minimize it. people have been subject to discipline here for tactics of dishonesty like this,

Apologizing is the open correct way for correcting a mistake posted here. Going back and deleting it is not honesty.

Dave
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1366  
Old 12-16-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,011
Thanks: 29
Thanked 55 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
See what I mean about people rolling back their prior statements?

But I think that even your revised statement may be inaccurate. Like much speculation and chat room gossip, you are a victim of sampling bias. It is likely that there were some who spoke less critically of the captain, but it was less "newsworthy" so their statements did not go viral like the critical statements.

It's easy to sit at your computer with 20/20 hindsight and say the captain made the wrong decision. Since there were fatalities, it is clear that it was a bad decision. It goes without saying, which is why it is not necessary to repeat it and repeat it and repeat it...
Good for you Rick. Good observations But you won't reach everyone

You mean you dont think if the repeat it and repeat it you can turn opinions into facts and browbeat others into submission
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1367  
Old 12-16-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,011
Thanks: 29
Thanked 55 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bountydaughter View Post
I do not believe egotistical described him as a captain. He was experienced and knowledgeable but not to the point of conceit. Was he confident? Yes, again not to the point of egotistical. I had posted previously:
"Anyone that knew Robin and watched that interview knew that he was poking fun at that reporter. His "chasing hurricanes" comment has been completely taken out of context. That was his sense of humor. As far as his stating there is no bad weather only different kinds, he did truly believe that. Weather was something you could manage. He had sailed in all different kinds of weather and up to this point, successfully. As far as that interview, if this incident had not happened no one except people that watch public access tv in Maine would have ever seen it." Boastful was also not a term to describe Robin either as a man or a captain.
People make decisions based on past experience and presumed ability all the time. Sometimes bad things happen and it does not have to do with being egotistical or stupid decision making. For example, I live in New England and it snows here. There are times when it snows very hard and the state "recommends" that drivers stay off the roads. Many people make a decision to drive anyway based on what they think the conditions of the roads are, their previous experience with driving in the snow and their confidence in their driving abilities. If the decision is made to drive to work, the store or whatever does that make that person reckless and egotistical? Confidence does not equal ego.
I totally agree with you. Having met Robin more than a few times you have written what I believed to be true about him. While I can count the times I met him on one hand you have identified what I though he was about. He was a decent smart intelligent thoughtful caring man.

I am very sorry for your personal loss and ours too.

Dave
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1368  
Old 12-16-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,011
Thanks: 29
Thanked 55 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 7
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bountydaughter View Post
chef2sail, I ask that you practice what you preach:
"I would assume she is not a family member, but is merely a former crew/cult member based on her apparent departure from reality and lack of logic in reasoning."
How is this not trashing me? First, I can tell you that you assume wrong. I have already stated that I am Captain Walbridge's daughter. I can also assure you that I have a firm grip on reality and I am not lacking in logic. I am insulted by your term "cult member" as Robin did not run a cult. I am sure that anyone ever associated with the Bounty would also be insulted by that remark.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I am here to express mine. Most opinions here are not based in fact or knowledge. You are entitled to them nonetheless. My opinions are based on the fact that I knew the man which none of you can say.
Bounty daughter I think if you go back and reread this you will see that I was posting stuff which others have said in previous threads as well as recently about you by Jamewilson which I found offensive to be posted about you. I was defending you and had put his quote in there as is normal in postings here

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameswilson29
I doubt a trained therapist could even guess what would be the best way for a particular individual to work out her grief. Obviously she voluntarily chose to participate in a particularly heated discussion about a controversial topic. No one is forcing her to post here.

Perhaps challenging her irrational beliefs will help her recover from this atrocity, and save her life someday in the future. I would assume she is not a family member, but is merely a former crew/cult member based on her apparent departure from reality and lack of logic in reasoning.

Here is the irrational thought process (which some of the Sailnet members seem to have adopted too):

1. Capt. Walbridge was experienced, well-liked and respected.

2. His crew would follow him anywhere. (And we should respect their opinion even though most on this listserv have more sailing and boat maintenance experience. [Riding as a passenger on a ship in the ocean and pulling on a halyard when instructed does not qualify one for much of anything].)

3. Therefore, Capt. Walbridge could not have done anything as monumentally stupid and reckless as sailing a poorly-maintained movie prop out into one of the largest storms in maritime history against the better judgment of almost every experienced mariner and professional captain with an ounce of common sense, thus causing the death of one innocent woman in his care and endangering dozens of people.

4. If only we could blame or invent something other than his obviously poor judgment as the root cause of this atrocity, thus we need to wait for the results of an investigation.
I have been a defender of you dad Robin all along and did/ do not like seeing them attack you either. I know you can standup for yourself.

Dave
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1369  
Old 12-16-2012
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 9,122
Thanks: 10
Thanked 143 Times in 129 Posts
Rep Power: 6
Minnewaska will become famous soon enough Minnewaska will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
.......Some of the facts that have emerged do seem to give credence to the argument that Bounty had survived more intense conditions in the past. As we try to speculate on what happened, these mitigating facts may shed some light on the captain's thinking at the time.
More intense than a Category 1 hurricane? And that's the crux of the complacency argument, it's not speculation.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.

Last edited by Minnewaska; 12-16-2012 at 05:45 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #1370  
Old 12-16-2012
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,191
Thanks: 21
Thanked 98 Times in 81 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP
...One last comment to say that if not all Tall ship Captains made public statements about Bounty's captain to sail out of port to an hurricane, all that talked showed disapproval about that decision...


See what I mean about people rolling back their prior statements?

But I think that even your revised statement may be inaccurate. .....
????? do you mind to explain???? Like that you are just bashing.

Please post the statement that I have changed. Some here have in fact changed of opinion, and everybody can change opinion, but that was not my case. I have been pretty consistent in my views.

Maybe you should quote the complete statement made recently:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
...
One last comment to say that if not all Tall ship Captains made public statements about Bounty's captain to sail out of port to an hurricane, all that talked showed disapproval about that decision. If that was a debatable decision it would be natural that many would come forward defending Bounty's Captain decision. After all he was one of them and nobody likes to see "one of us" unjustifiably blamed.
Besides being more polite, what has changed regarding previous statements?

Regards

Paulo
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rhodes Bounty ll white rabbit Introduce Yourself 3 07-13-2014 05:00 AM
New Member - Hardin 45 ( 44 voyager bounty ) Bianchi Introduce Yourself 9 01-29-2011 09:33 PM
HELP!! , Need move a boat NC to WA (Rhodes Bounty II, 40'10 x 28' x 10'3" x 5'9") sailandoar General Discussion (sailing related) 1 08-23-2006 01:11 PM
Bounty Windjammer Spectacle (Boothbay Register) NewsReader News Feeds 0 06-23-2006 03:15 PM
April 28, 1789, Aboard the HMS Bounty: NewsReader Mass Bay Sailors 0 04-28-2006 01:15 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:26 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.