HMS Bounty in trouble... - Page 14 - SailNet Community

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  #131  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
Some here have made reference to the fact that the HMS Bounty was built for the 1962 film "Mutiny on the Bounty" and speculated that the vessel may have been a 'movie prop' and, therefore, less than seaworthy. The HMS Bounty was built by Smith & Rhuland in Lunenburg, Nova Scotia. Smith & Rhuland were commercial shipbuilders from 1900 until 1967, launching over 250 hulls including, tugs, ferries, minesweepers, cargo vessels, yachts, and Grand Banks schooners (including the Bluenose and the Bluenose II). They didn't build movie props; everything launched from their slip was solid & seaworthy.

Apparently quite a bit of work was done over the last 10 years (mostly in Maine yards), including re-planking the hull, replacing and rebuilding main engines and generators and some new spars. That said, I can't comment on the condition of the HMS Bounty as she sailed on her last voyage. Any wooden boat owner will tell you it is a continuous cycle of maintenance. I, for one, will wait until the report of the investigation comes out (at least a few months, I am guessing) before speculating on the root causes of this tragedy.
A sail boat or any boat is built by a builder following a specification list. This was a boat that was meant to be used on a single movie and burned at the end of the movie. I am quite sure the specification list take well in consideration that this was just a boat that should last some months and not a boat to endure many storms and many years of sailing.

The price of building a boat with the specifications needed to stay together during some months would be very different of one that was built to stay afloat a lifetime so I am pretty sure the specifications would take that into consideration. Movies are run on a tight budget

Regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 11-01-2012 at 10:51 AM.
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  #132  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
A sail boat or any boat is built by a builder following a specification list. This was a boat that was meant to be used on a single movie and burned at the end of the movie. I am quite sure the specification list take well in consideration that this was just a boat that should last some months and not a boat to endure many storms and many years of sailing.

The price of building a boat with the specifications needed to stay together during some months would be very different of one that was built to stay afloat a lifetime so I am pretty sure the specifications would take that into consideration. Movies are run on a tight budget

Regards

Paulo
Sorry Paulo, but you are misinformed. The HMS Bounty was built to the original drawings for the 1784 Bounty, found in the British Admiralty archives (she was made slightly larger to accommodate the filming of the movie). Also the budget argument doesn't hold true in that era - think of films like Ben Hur - huge money was spent by Hollywood in those days. After launch in Nova Scotia, HMS Bounty was SAILED to Tahiti for location filming. In fact, MGM planned to burn the vessel there for the movie, just as the original was burned by the mutineers - realism at any cost! Anyone who was ever been aboard HMS Bounty will tell you that this was not a prop boat - think of her as more like Gazela Primiero or other working sailboats built in your country.
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  #133  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
. It seems that the crew was neither big enough or experienced.

“A lot of the people in our group are just regular guys and gals who like to dress up as pirates, but many of them have never really set foot on the deck of a ship at sea,” he said.

http://staugustine.com/news/local-ne...y#.UJKGdG9ImE9

This is out of context or the article wasn't clear; the quote is from William McRea, who works for the St Augustine Pirate Museum, not the Bounty, and the "our group" he's talking about are the people who play pirates in St Augustine who visited the ship, not who sailed it. Here's a bit more context for the quote:

"McRea said the crew was “a good bunch” who impressed the members of his group with stories of sailing the high seas.

“A lot of the people in our group are just regular guys and gals who like to dress up as pirates, but many of them have never really set foot on the deck of a ship at sea,” he said. “So it was a thrill to hear all the exciting stories offered by the crew members, ..."
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  #134  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
Some here have made reference to the fact that the HMS Bounty was built for the 1962 film "Mutiny on the Bounty" and speculated that the vessel may have been a 'movie prop' and, therefore, less than seaworthy. The HMS Bounty was built by Smith & Rhuland in Lunenburg, Nova Scotia. Smith & Rhuland were commercial shipbuilders from 1900 until 1967, launching over 250 hulls including, tugs, ferries, minesweepers, cargo vessels, yachts, and Grand Banks schooners (including the Bluenose and the Bluenose II). They didn't build movie props; everything launched from their slip was solid & seaworthy.
Smith & Rhuland in Lunenburg may be a good shipbuilder, but they were not the one who funded the project. There "may be" some compromise there building a prop for a movie to building a boat for ocean going voyage. Besides, over the years, Bounty has deteriorated without much of the funding. Bounty may be good to look at at the dock as for educational purpose. Heading into the storm of the century with limited inexperienced crews is a bit too much.

I understand that there are a few captain friends of Walbridge defend his decision. This tragedy could have been avoid.
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  #135  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
Sorry Paulo, but you are misinformed. The HMS Bounty was built to the original drawings for the 1784 Bounty, found in the British Admiralty archives (she was made slightly larger to accommodate the filming of the movie). Also the budget argument doesn't hold true in that era - think of films like Ben Hur - huge money was spent by Hollywood in those days. After launch in Nova Scotia, HMS Bounty was SAILED to Tahiti for location filming. In fact, MGM planned to burn the vessel there for the movie, just as the original was burned by the mutineers - realism at any cost! Anyone who was ever been aboard HMS Bounty will tell you that this was not a prop boat - think of her as more like Gazela Primiero or other working sailboats built in your country.
We all here are just speculating, no more right or wrong. The true part was the boat was taking in water very fast. If Bounty has suffered hull damage becasue of the storm and causing the flooding, the survivors would have speaking out already. They are silent now out of respect of their Captain and families.
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  #136  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

A fundamental problem in the "fog of a hurricane foundering" is that facts we do know are not fully lining up with all the statements being made by interested parties. That always gives rise to some suspicion. I'm sure more of the story will come to light. It's almost impossible to keep 14 people from talking.
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  #137  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

we can theorize out our ears and invent scenarios, or we can read all the words penned in virtual log shared openly with all on their website and their fb pages--was described step by step thruout the situation and rescue was on tape provided by uscg, and uscg had pix of the sinking of bounty--her last minutes---
OR we can accept the words written about the event and respect the boat lost and her mater of 20 years missing in the same sea that claimed her.
is a sad time- why do folks have to bash decisions made and counter the info as written by the folks OF bounty?
please read the info they provided then make your comments to the decisions made--to invent scenarios that were not in play is not respectful to the dead and missing.
it wasnt difficult to follow the proceedings closely thru their own words and pictures of weather and their tracking pattern thru the narrow spacing between storm front and hurricane.

when bounty was in sd in 2008, spring, i spent some time on board--more than the tour--as i had a friend who was crew and was incredibly proud of his ship--that boat was stout. she was well maintained, and hauled regularly--i saw pix of the work they did in 2007--wow!!--more often than our own recreational boats. i saw her bones. she was incredible, and she had soul and a spirit to match her build.

bounty is an icon that will be missed.

dont ye think it strange that the bounty and her master of 20 yrs and direct descendent of fletcher christian all go missing on same day????
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Last edited by zeehag; 11-01-2012 at 12:03 PM.
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  #138  
Old 11-01-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingNwing View Post
This is out of context or the article wasn't clear; the quote is from William McRea, who works for the St Augustine Pirate Museum, not the Bounty, and the "our group" he's talking about are the people who play pirates in St Augustine who visited the ship, not who sailed it. Here's a bit more context for the quote:
I am not sure if it is logical to assume most of the non-commercial tall ships are manned by volunteers who have a day job in other professions.
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  #139  
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
I'm sure more of the story will come to light. It's almost impossible to keep 14 people from talking.
May be the survivors is waiting for a movie or book deal.
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  #140  
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

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Originally Posted by rockDAWG View Post
I am not sure if it is logical to assume most of the non-commercial tall ships are manned by volunteers who have a day job in other professions.
Okay, I still wasn't clear - the people in McRae's group - the ones he made the comment about - are NOT the people who were sailing on the Bounty. The people in McRae's group are fans of Bounty. Some of the Bounty sailors may have been volunteers, I don't know. I do know that Bounty has no shortage of people who wish(ed) to sail on her; they were required to serve on other, less glamorous duties, such as maintenance, for some time before being promoted to the opportunity to sail. That meant that the people who were sailing knew this old tall ship pretty well, regardless of how much experience sailing modern fiberglass boats they may or may not have had. (And yes, they did *sail* as much as possible to move the ship on their tours)
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