HMS Bounty in trouble... - Page 71 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Vessels Lost, Missing, or in Danger
 Not a Member? 


Like Tree718Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #701  
Old 11-17-2012
MarkofSeaLife's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,474
Thanks: 29
Thanked 92 Times in 75 Posts
Rep Power: 5
MarkofSeaLife is on a distinguished road
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.aaron View Post
My point is I have a pretty good insight to both culture's and some how fall inbetween.
In your opinion, in which type of employment is their least chance of injury?

Is commercial tug crew much better paid, vastly better, or just a bit better?

Last question: pony tail when you were on tall ships?
__________________
Sea Life
Notes on a Circumnavigation:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #702  
Old 11-17-2012
TakeFive's Avatar
Proud "picnic sailor"
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 2,716
Thanks: 6
Thanked 54 Times in 51 Posts
Rep Power: 6
TakeFive will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
If you go to the beginning of this thread you would find many that thought that the Captain attitude was acceptable because a ship is safer at sea than in a port or because the captain was an experienced sailor that had sailed in worst weather...
There was never anything of the sort posted on this thread. Maybe YOU should go back and reread. When you find something, post it here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
...or that an investigation was needed to see if the Captain was to blame or not...
Are you saying that no investigation is needed? That the USCG will be wasting their time? Why don't you call them and suggest that - I'm sure they'll be open to your opinions.

As we have told you, over and over, those of us who are interested in the investigation are not suggesting that the captain is not to blame. I believe that competent captains don't just suddenly lose their judgement. There are external factors that lead to their incorrect judgements, and we can learn from what the investigation reveals about those external factors. USCG will want to know whether their enforcement procedures could have helped prevent it. We all will benefit from an investigation.

It really is getting tiring to hear you constantly misquote us and attempt to mislead others about what we are saying. You often have useful things to contribute to this forum, but on this message thread you have passed the point of diminishing returns.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Formerly posted as "RhythmDoctor"
1998 Catalina 250WK Take Five (at Anchorage Marina, Essington, on the Delaware River)
1991 15' Trophy (Lake Wallenpaupack)
1985 14' Phantom (Lake Wallenpaupack)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #703  
Old 11-17-2012
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 99 Times in 82 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
What are the particular liscences Robin Walbridge had?
What are Captain Walbridges past experience,vessels he served on?
What disqualifies him from being a professional captain?
Are there 20,000 professional captains in the world?
What qualifications and professional checks do people who want to join the
social blog gCaptain have to undergo?
Is gCaptain really a professional organization or just another social media internet blog
site?

....
One is a professional organization of pilots which obvious qualifications ( and they are vetted) to post on...the other is a social media site which anyone can join and post on and can make up their credentials

gCaptain is what? a professional organziation with vetted credentials? or is a soicial media bloig site.

My point is here that when weighing statements, facts, and opinons to take into consideration the source. Thats all.
Captain Robin Walbridge was a professional Captain and had a 1600-ton license. Regarding his experience :

..he secured his 50-ton license while working on the Miller houseboats on the Suwanee River in Florida where he was the field mechanic for five years....He went on to work on the Governor Stone in Apalachicola, Florida as Captain, conducting day sail programs, and crew training programs for the operation of the vessel. It was here he earned his 100-ton license....Robin moved on to HMS Rose in 1993 as First and Second mate and went on to obtain his 500-ton Captain's license. He continued to work with youth sail training programs, developing programs for trainees along the eastern seaboard and Great Lakes. In 1995, he obtained his 1600-ton license.

Enter HMS Bounty in 1995.

TallShipBounty.org

Regarding gCaptain forum is not a Captain's forum. They say about it:

With over 20,000 members from around the world, this forum has essentially grown to become the social media platform for the professional maritime industry.

It is an open forum but the ones that are members are the ones that are related with the maritime industry, including professional sailors and captains. You don't need to be a member to access to each member profile and see its maritime qualifications and their professional story. I did.

gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore News

rergards

Paulo
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #704  
Old 11-17-2012
Capt.aaron's Avatar
KNOT KNOWN
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Guanaja, Bay Islands, Honduras
Posts: 1,320
Thanks: 1
Thanked 20 Times in 20 Posts
Rep Power: 3
Capt.aaron is on a distinguished road
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Industry vs. Tallship life.
Both can be incredably dangerous, On the Tugs dudes get cut in half by wires under load and 4 inch lines snapping, and overboard's. We lost a captain this year, they hope he fell overboard any way's. it's a rough bunch.

A schooner kid died in Key West this year, he fell from the mast head.
( his girfriend was on the smart end of the hoist and let him go.)

We are paid very well in the industry, the pay is crap on the schooners. I cut my own hair with dull scissors on the tall ship, kind of a spikey mess with shackle grease as hair gel. Now I shave it with clippers but I did get a tattoo on my head when I was on the tallship and it's still there.
__________________
" Some are boat wise and some are other wise"

Last edited by Capt.aaron; 11-17-2012 at 04:51 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #705  
Old 11-17-2012
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 99 Times in 82 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post






There was never anything of the sort posted on this thread. Maybe YOU should go back and reread. When you find something, post it here.
Just on the first 3 pages or so :

They were on passage from Canada to Florida, and they had left Canada before Sandy was even a tic on NHC's radar. They detoured WELL east of the storm track,
...
They really weren't being that crazy and conditions where they are aren't so horrible.

It doesn't seem like 18' seas should have been too much for a boat of that size. Sounds like she opened up some seams and pumps couldn't keep up with it. ..There may be no fault other than inadequate pump capability or lack of bottom maintenance.
….
Many larger vessels (including navy ships, cruise ships) put to sea for hurricanes since they are more likely to be damaged or sunk in harbour. I suspect the HMS Bounty was somewhere in the projected landfall area of Sandy and was trying to get south to safer water...damned if you do and damned if you don't.
….
That totally made sense, then, given Sandy's predicted impacts in NY and New England, that they'd be safer at sea than in port. They ssailed out due east to get well clear of the storm before continuing south.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
..

Are you saying that no investigation is needed? That the USCG will be wasting their time? Why don't you call them and suggest that - I'm sure they'll be open to your opinions.

.

Regarding an investigation, of course it is necessary, no to access Captain's blame into deliberately sailing a XVIII century designed wooden ship on the path of an hurricane but to understand how can this can have happened and to prevent that it will never happen again.

regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 11-17-2012 at 04:27 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #706  
Old 11-17-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,042
Thanks: 30
Thanked 57 Times in 53 Posts
Rep Power: 8
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Paulo,

Well I am a memeber of gCaptain and certainly not a professional. Its a social media site and I would not want to quote from it or pass it off as the " authority or on professional captains anymore tha Sailnet is>

Also your reporting from the social media site is not even handed and there is a much differening opinions on the site as on Sailnet.

NOTE: This does not mean I am defending the captains actions.

For isnstance the follwoing psoted on gCaptain
Quote:
The Bounty fiasco and an undeserved black eye

“Sail training” and tall ship sailors has certainly gotten a black eye over the past two weeks. Some of the criticisms are well thought out; and, hopefully, some positive things will come out of the Bounty fiasco.

However, this forum has hosted many unwarranted, disparaging comments about the people who crew these “tall ships” I am posting this to, hopefully, put some of the “sail training” discussion back on a charted course.

I had the privilege to meet a lot of really great people in the wrongly named “sail training community”. Many of them were retired people who want to the opportunity to give back to the community. Some were fresh out of college. Some were attracted by the living history. Some were looking for an outdoor activity. And, yes, some of them were tree-hugging, granola chomping , want-to be actors, who showed up to volunteer because the renn fair was rained out.

But the common thread is that they are very good people. And they deserve far better treatment than they have received on this forum over the past couple of weeks.

And if you think your better than they are, in part, because you were able to pass a Coast Guard multiple choice test, you might be mistaken. PMC

Professional organizations tend to have more credibility if you choose them to bolster you opinions than passing off a social blog sie as the authority on the sunbject and quoting them.

Another example of as takefive put it
Quote:
you constantly misquote us and attempt to mislead others about what we are saying
' Its getting old

You do have a lot of other good posts, however I think your time ( as well as mine) may have run its course on this thread.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #707  
Old 11-17-2012
PCP's Avatar
PCP PCP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 99 Times in 82 Posts
Rep Power: 10
PCP will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
..


Another example of as takefive put it ' Its getting old


That is very low. When somebody wants to say something like that, it is wrong to use others to hide behind them. I certainly would be very clear in what I was meaning if I was accusing someone of wrongdoing. Takefive is talking about a misquote I have made, not of a poster but from an article, attributing some sentences to the wrong person. That article was confusing, at least for me and when someone noticed that I was wrong I acknowledged and apologized.

Some difference from you that had quoted me wrongly and did not apologized, mumbling something about my posts being confusing.

I am referring to this:



Regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 11-17-2012 at 11:42 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #708  
Old 11-18-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,042
Thanks: 30
Thanked 57 Times in 53 Posts
Rep Power: 8
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Usually when people quote they do not copy the others moniker or avatar. It confusing and makes it look like I just posted this when it in fact was weeks ago. No one else on here does this ...any special reason?

Is your purpose on here to to help others or do you have a hidden agenda directed at me? You can try and point the finger back at me but before you do I suggest you look at your tone and posts specifically directed at me. I put you on ignore, but found out you were continuing to respond to my posts in a negative and inflamatory manner when they got forwarded to me by my friends on here though PM,s.

I apologize to others if I seem argumentative or seem distracted from my normal posts and I will try and do better. Sorry to waste your time with this nonsense. Lies cannot go unanswered lest they become perceived as the truth.

Dave
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner

Last edited by chef2sail; 11-18-2012 at 01:14 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #709  
Old 11-18-2012
chef2sail's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 7,042
Thanks: 30
Thanked 57 Times in 53 Posts
Rep Power: 8
chef2sail will become famous soon enough
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

So as Minnie posted complacency is one of the dangers. How can we prevent that in the future?
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
  #710  
Old 11-18-2012
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 9,339
Thanks: 10
Thanked 154 Times in 140 Posts
Rep Power: 6
Minnewaska will become famous soon enough Minnewaska will become famous soon enough
Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
So as Minnie posted complacency is one of the dangers. How can we prevent that in the future?
Prior to a flight, we use things like checklists and mandatory weather briefings. They help, but complacency can also cause one to skip through them too quickly.

I think the solution to this one is going to put the Tall Ship community directly in the bullseye. By design, they are intended to conjure up the thought of our forefathers sailing the open ocean in a time without any modern convenience or safety. They didn't have the ability to forecast weather like we can.

Combine the romance of crewing a ship that crossed oceans hundreds of years ago with the realization that they had to tackle severe weather and the thought of adventure can probably overcome the logic of risk management. Compound that with what appears to be a loophole in how these ships and their crew are regulated and that may have been the real perfect storm around Sandy.
MarkofSeaLife and Brewgyver like this.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rhodes Bounty ll white rabbit Introduce Yourself 3 07-13-2014 06:00 AM
New Member - Hardin 45 ( 44 voyager bounty ) Bianchi Introduce Yourself 9 01-29-2011 10:33 PM
HELP!! , Need move a boat NC to WA (Rhodes Bounty II, 40'10 x 28' x 10'3" x 5'9") sailandoar General Discussion (sailing related) 1 08-23-2006 02:11 PM
Bounty Windjammer Spectacle (Boothbay Register) NewsReader News Feeds 0 06-23-2006 04:15 PM
April 28, 1789, Aboard the HMS Bounty: NewsReader Mass Bay Sailors 0 04-28-2006 02:15 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:20 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.