[Yofy]

If I understand correctly and your instruments are not working even while the engine is working, and the alternator has the proper output, then the problem is not with your batteries.

This would tell me to start checking for a bad connection somewhere. Without knowing how your boat is wired it's hard to point to a specific connection. I would start with: Alternator to point of charging? Battery switch to pannel?

It could also be your battery switch itself... we really need to know how your boat is wired before we can give more specific trouble shooting advice.

Manny

 

[SEMIJim]

BF,
I had them on both last night in order to recharge them.

You mean while you were on shore power? What kind of shore power charger do you have? Mine is a Xantrex TrueCharge 10TB. It has two separate "channels" - one for each battery. Its output connects directly to each battery. The battery switch need not be on for the charger to work.

The only time the battery switch setting should matter for charging the batteries is when you're charging from the engine's alternator.

Jim

 

[SEMIJim]

Are 12v fuse systems like Christmas tree lights in that if one is out none will work?

No. Not unless you have a master fuse or breaker, like your home breaker panel will have.

Jim

 

[SEMIJim]

Faster,
The batteries are fairly new, and this is the first time they've been run all the way down. They came right back once the engine had had a chance to recharge.

Define "came right back?" Batteries that have been completely or nearly completely discharged take quite some time to be fully recharged.

Also, wouldn't the depth sounder, cabin lights etc. work once the engine was running?

Yes. But I'm a bit curious about this:

but I finally got a battery in there, got the engine started, switched the batteries out, and recharged my dead batteries.

How exactly did you effect the battery switcheroo? I'm hoping you either used the temporary battery with jumper cables to one of your regular batteries. Or, if you temporarily replaced one of yours with the temporary battery, I'm hoping you did something like:

• Install temporary battery in "1"
• Start engine
• Switch to "2" (this should be safe with modern, make-before-break battery switches that are in good working order)
• Put regular battery back in "1"
• Switch to "both"

I'm hoping that at no time was the engine running with anything in the 12V electrical system energized and there being no battery at all connected. Besides the possibility of toasting the alternator, doing that, you can toast anything that was energized at the time. Don't ask me how I know that.

Jim

 

[dfloeter]

This sounds too much like I found on the first night of a North Channel trip last year. I was plugged into shore power with no appliances or lights on except the standby mode of the FM cassette deck. Around 2AM I awoke to the tell tale tones the radio outputs when the batteries go dead, yes I did this before but with previous batteries and other circumstances.

After checking the obvious circuits and narrowing it down to the cabin circuit I traced the wired down and found a very hot auto quality butt splice in the head. A fire would have been next as the fuse was not blowing and the resistance was huge. Before I found the cause I was watching the volt meter drop visibly whenever I turned the Cabin switch on, dropping one half volt in a couple of seconds. Needless to say, I pulled the butt splice off the wire and respliced it properly the next day.

So that's my tale and hopefully your solution might in the end be as simple.

Dietrich

Calliope Catalina 30

 

[HoffaLives]

This sounds too much like I found on the first night of a North Channel trip last year. I was plugged into shore power with no appliances or lights on except the standby mode of the FM cassette deck. Around 2AM I awoke to the tell tale tones the radio outputs when the batteries go dead, yes I did this before but with previous batteries and other circumstances.

After checking the obvious circuits and narrowing it down to the cabin circuit I traced the wired down and found a very hot auto quality butt splice in the head. A fire would have been next as the fuse was not blowing and the resistance was huge. Before I found the cause I was watching the volt meter drop visibly whenever I turned the Cabin switch on, dropping one half volt in a couple of seconds. Needless to say, I pulled the butt splice off the wire and respliced it properly the next day.

So that's my tale and hopefully your solution might in the end be as simple.

Dietrich

Calliope Catalina 30

this is exactly why i harp on about limiting connections and keeping things as simple as possible. people worry about propane (another thread) and yet i would bet SD's right nut that far more boats have burned due to poor connections. if you paid less than $70.00 for your crimping tool, you're a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[sailingdog]

I'd have to agree that electrical problems are probably responsible for more damage than propane, but not as dramatic looking most times.

Hoffa doesn't know how to shop obviously...Look here, Here, and Here

Obviously, there's a reason he had to fake his death.

 

[chucklesR]

Seems like you have two problems,
a) low lights the night before (even tho connected to the pier and charger on)
b) GPS etc.. not engerizing from the 12v panel even tho engine is running; apparently the altenator is working because the batteries are getting a charge.

Since seldom in life does two things go wrong at once let's look for the simple solution.
A) your charger crapped out a1) your charger crapped out because your batteries crapped out or at least one of them did and maybe that boiled off the other

B) while farting around in the battery compartment you knocked loose or did not reconnect either the positive or negative cable that supplies power to your panel; or you reversed a connection (only takes a second) and blew the primary panel fuse.

There is no need to panic, it's not magic.

Alternatively, The more complex response:
While playing monopoly with the kids the lead horsie figure was loose and running around making random shorts in the system by creating lead horse droppings on connections, then it got hungry and ate some copper cable and caused opens in other places.
To fix that requires 4 bottles of rum, food for a week, 3 naked virgins (female, non-minors) and from 8 to 10 viagra's, PM me with my airline ticket reservations and I'll drop in and fix it.

 

[SailNet Archive]

It sounds to me like you forget to hook up the + wire for your 12 volt stuff or you have a bad connection to them

 

[sailortjk1]

Any update Hog?
What did you find out?

 

[sailingdog]

Chuckles-

Be careful what you wish for or sailhog will have you over to help and be offering you three very nice sows... as you didn't specify what species the virgins had to be.

Seems like you have two problems,
a) low lights the night before (even tho connected to the pier and charger on)
b) GPS etc.. not engerizing from the 12v panel even tho engine is running; apparently the altenator is working because the batteries are getting a charge.

Since seldom in life does two things go wrong at once let's look for the simple solution.
A) your charger crapped out a1) your charger crapped out because your batteries crapped out or at least one of them did and maybe that boiled off the other

B) while farting around in the battery compartment you knocked loose or did not reconnect either the positive or negative cable that supplies power to your panel; or you reversed a connection (only takes a second) and blew the primary panel fuse.

There is no need to panic, it's not magic.

Alternatively, The more complex response:
While playing monopoly with the kids the lead horsie figure was loose and running around making random shorts in the system by creating lead horse droppings on connections, then it got hungry and ate some copper cable and caused opens in other places.
To fix that requires 4 bottles of rum, food for a week, 3 naked virgins (female, non-minors) and from 8 to 10 viagra's, PM me with my airline ticket reservations and I'll drop in and fix it.

 

[sailhog]

Errr.... this is a hard post for me...
But here goes...
I... I... I... Can I just say...
Okay, I'm just going to get this over with...

The batteries on my C30 are under the nav desk. The way it is wired, and the manner in which the batteries sit in the batt. bucket, and the way the wires emerge from the liner behind the nav station... well, in shuffling the batteries around, the pos. and neg. wires of the house batt. got tucked down under the plastic battery bucket in such a way that I could not see them.

So there. I want to remind everyone that snickering will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. If you snicker, you will be arrested by the Sailnet police. So no snickering. Anyway, that part of the mystery is solved.

Now if you all can stop snickering for a moment, I do have one lingering concern, and it has to do with why two good batteries would die in 12 hours with just a couple of little cabin lights drawing off of them. Any suggestions? Obviously, the battery charger was and is on the fritz.

P.S.: I would appreciate it if you didn't PM all of your buddies and tell them about this little mix up of mine. I know you all are laughing at me behind my back, making nasty little comments like, "God, Sailhog is stupid..." or "If he had that pos. and neg. lines up his ass he'd know where they were." I"m feeling a little vulnerable right now...

 

[sailortjk1]

So the cables were not connected to the terminals?
Is that what you are saying?

And believe me, I am not snickering.
Its a boat, anything is possible!

 

[sailhog]

TJK,
The starting battery cables were hooked up, but not the house side.
Okay, so let's change the subject...
Whaddaya say we got grab a beer and talk about why those batteries died with only those itty bitty lights drawing on em?

 

[TrueBlue]

So hog, you now realize that the next time you post a question to these forums, we'll be sure to ask you - "Is it plugged in?"

 

[sailortjk1]

Did you check the water levels as was suggested earlier?

 

[chucklesR]

Buddies got a C30, understand how that could happen (dark and tight).

Back to the simple solution again: they were not fully charged to begin with.
You didn't specify what the capacity was, assuming (as it's a C30) you have 90 amphour wet cells (likely, average battery) and you were at/about 80% to start, two lights at 1 ah per for 8 hrs (overnight), 16 ah down... yep they would be rather dim come morning.
BTW, what was the anchor light running off, assuming it was on? Factor that in if you missed it and question is answered eh?

 

[sailhog]

TB,
If I post a question on engine trouble you'll ask, "Is there fuel in the tank?" And I'll reply in some really hyper-sensitive way like, "What are you saying? What the f--- do you mean by that?"

On the way home that morning I didn't have acceess to the GPS and the depth sounder was in-op due to lack of electricty, so I had to keep to the deep side of the channel and take the sure way, as there are a number of shoals to run around on... anyway, it meant a longer route, but we still made the 17 mile journey in 2:05. We had the currents flushing us down the Beaufort River, and then we had them flushing us back up Port Royal Sound -- and it was blowing like snot off of our port quarter for most of the way. I've never gone that fast in that boat.

 

[sailhog]

TJK,
I checked the water levels, and they are fine.

Chuck,
Come to think of it, they would not have been fully charged when we arrived, as we sailed the entire distance (17 miles in 3.25 hours) with the stereo, GPS, press. water, etc. all on. All of this would have been drawing off the house batt. The engine ran for less than 5 minutes as we pulled into the marina. The anchor light was not on, as we were docked, but, as I mentioned, the charger was not recharging the batts. I had the switch on "both" all through the night to allow (I thought) them to recharge.

 

[chucklesR]

Sometimes it's good to be a simple in a simple world with simple problems and simple solutions..
On the other hand, I was looking forward stories of chasing lead horsies around