Marine Surveyors - Page 7 - SailNet Community
 47Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #61 of 76 Old 03-05-2017
Member
 
JimMcGee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marathon, Florida
Posts: 2,417
Thanks: 103
Thanked 85 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 15
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcb View Post
I'm not sure worrying about an unsupervised surveyor braking your boat during a survey is a realistic concern.

If your boat can survive a few hours of sailing in moderate conditions, surely it can survive a survey. It's not like your handing him the keys and telling him to take it for a sail.
Arcb, I think you underestimate just how bad some of these guys are...

Currently Boatless

The sail, the play of its pulse so like our own lives: so thin and yet so full of life, so noiseless when it labors hardest, so noisy and impatient when least effective." - Henry David Thoreau
JimMcGee is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 76 Old 03-05-2017
Dirt Free
 
boatpoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,614
Thanks: 22
Thanked 147 Times in 142 Posts
Rep Power: 12
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMcGee View Post
Arcb, I think you underestimate just how bad some of these guys are...
I know of one who took a boat out on an unauthorized sea trial and ran it hard aground but as much as I criticize my own industry, that is an extremely rare (only one I've heard of) case.
JimMcGee likes this.

The hysterical laughter you hear as you drive a way in your"new" boat ..... is the seller.
boatpoker is online now  
post #63 of 76 Old 03-05-2017
Moderator
 
Arcb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 4,008
Thanks: 214
Thanked 201 Times in 197 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Maybe. What damage could they possibly do? I'm not giving them the key to the engine. I'm checking on the boat when they're done. I have 10% of the asking price from the buyer which I can not return if their surveyor has done something really crazy. The ones I have met, have all been boaters or boat owners at the very least.

Seriously, aside from bad advice, a bad report and screwing up an otherwise good deal, what could they possibly do to your boat?

Edit:. Oops, I think BP was typing at the same time as me. Even a hard grounding shouldn't result in a 10% devaluation of the vessel. Just keep the deposit. The buyers responsible for the actions of his surveyor.

Last edited by Arcb; 03-06-2017 at 01:33 PM.
Arcb is offline  
 
post #64 of 76 Old 03-05-2017 Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
 
My sentiments exactly...
Tucamonday is offline  
post #65 of 76 Old 03-05-2017
al brazzi
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Lower Chesapeake bay
Posts: 2,075
Thanks: 1
Thanked 82 Times in 82 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tucamonday View Post
Boatpoker-

I don't take it argumentative and it's a great question. I have always been told, don't answer a questions with a question so my answer is, I don't know.. lol

I would submit though, why as a boating community so we accept it?

Further to your earlier post on the seller being present. You propose the biggest catch 22 I can image in the boat world. Remember, the seller DOES NOT get to pick the surveyor and if the buyers surveyor is an imbecile then his/hers reports is now an official record of your vessel!!!!! Now seller gets to clean up the mess. My most recent experience (I was the seller) the buyer's surveyor started in with some of the most out landish inspection I have ever witnessed and if I had not been there to end it early (I should have ended it even earlier) who knows what I would have had to do?

Let me throw another little tid bit out there, I think you mentioned having a seller coming close to sueing you for a survey you did. I will tell you this, the first thing I did when this guy left is call my attorney, it was slanderous and libel but guess what? No E&O to go back on.. In other words since there is no oversight to the industry surveyors are running around with zero assets and assuming zero capability in their incompetence. If I sue and win I get his dog and other liquid assets, great proposition!

Maybe you can enlighten me. I have done some research in the last week and I can't even find a carrier that offers E&O to the industry, is there any coverage? I don't mean liability but Errors and Omissions!


Faster-

I know I opened the bag on the insurance thing so let me first say this, I am an agent not underwriting. That means I am in sales so the more I sell the more I make. Underwriters are the enemy in a sense.

However, there is a method to the madness. Remove surveyors from the discussion just for a moment, think of your situation involving any tangible asset. If you are protecting it from loss through insurance the better of a caretaker you are the less chance is of the asset incurring a loss. Underwriters are imperfect couple that with the fact that insurors by law must file rules and rates with every state in the union and now what we have are imperfect people following rules as best can be outlined. Insurors are aware of this and sometimes use a measure of care to assess an individual's merit of a caretaker. Think of it like this, say a insurance company says that lawns must be mowed before they insure a house. It's a measure of how well the insured may care for the property, stands to reason that a homeowner that does not maintain the yard may not shovel the walk in the winter and therefor experience a higher likelihood of a liability claim from someone falling of a slippery walkway. Again, coming from a person that is not a fan of the insurance industry you are better off with the company that insists on those ports and hatches being maintained that from the companies that don't care, more likely than not the boats that are not upkept with migrate to the companies with the lack underwriting and it's those companies that will absorb higher losses and guess what? Losses get passed to the consumer... From sales, the better my rate the more likely you are to come to me... Just a FYI...
I don't understand the permanent record statement you make here. If the buyer pays for the survey and the sale comes apart then how is this survey "recorded". Wouldn't a proper later survey be the next set of negotiating points for the transaction. Only one person owns the survey.
albrazzi is offline  
post #66 of 76 Old 03-06-2017
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1,167
Thanks: 5
Thanked 57 Times in 56 Posts
Rep Power: 20
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by albrazzi View Post
I don't understand the permanent record statement you make here. If the buyer pays for the survey and the sale comes apart then how is this survey "recorded". Wouldn't a proper later survey be the next set of negotiating points for the transaction. Only one person owns the survey.
I agree. The survey is not public, initially. The person or entity that pays for it owns it completely. That person could potentially sell it or give it away, but it's their decision.
For instance, when BoatUS orders up a survey on their dime, they own it and only release the part of the result that require an upgrade. That's what happened with my friend's boat.

IIRC he declined to purchase the complete survey from them, having done the required work. His insurance continued in force, for full agreed-on value. This all seemed fair enough to me...
(The required upgrade was logical even tho the potential 'risk' appeared quite minor to both of us. But then minimizing risk is what insurers do... !)
olson34 is offline  
post #67 of 76 Old 03-06-2017
Senior Member
 
travlin-easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Maryland - USA
Posts: 6,635
Thanks: 2
Thanked 131 Times in 110 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

I had an NAMS surveyor survey my boat and I cannot say enough good things about him. I was there during the entire survey, he was very thorough, and provided me with excellent service and saved me a bundle of money.

Gary
travlin-easy is online now  
post #68 of 76 Old 03-06-2017
Dirt Free
 
boatpoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,614
Thanks: 22
Thanked 147 Times in 142 Posts
Rep Power: 12
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by travlin-easy View Post
I had an NAMS surveyor survey my boat and I cannot say enough good things about him. I was there during the entire survey, he was very thorough, and provided me with excellent service and saved me a bundle of money.

Gary
Gary, we are all too ready to name the bad ones. You lucked out, let's name names and give the guy some credit.
JimMcGee likes this.

The hysterical laughter you hear as you drive a way in your"new" boat ..... is the seller.
boatpoker is online now  
post #69 of 76 Old 03-06-2017
Member
 
JimMcGee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marathon, Florida
Posts: 2,417
Thanks: 103
Thanked 85 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 15
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
I know of one who took a boat out on an unauthorized sea trial and ran it hard aground but as much as I criticize my own industry, that is an extremely rare (only one I've heard of) case.
LOL, I think he went into home inspections!

BTW, thanks for the time you put into your web site and the advice for finding a marine surveyor.

Currently Boatless

The sail, the play of its pulse so like our own lives: so thin and yet so full of life, so noiseless when it labors hardest, so noisy and impatient when least effective." - Henry David Thoreau
JimMcGee is offline  
post #70 of 76 Old 03-06-2017
Member
 
JimMcGee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marathon, Florida
Posts: 2,417
Thanks: 103
Thanked 85 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 15
 
Re: Marine Surveyors

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcb View Post
Maybe. What damage could they possibly do? I'm not giving them the key to the engine. I'm checking on the boat when they're done. I have 10% of the asking price from the buyer which I can not return if their surveyor has done something really crazy. The ones I have met, have all been boaters or boat owners at the very least.

Seriously, aside from bad advice, a bad report and screwing up an otherwise good deal, what could they possibly do to your boat?

Edit:. Oops, I think BP was typing at the same time as me. Even a hard grounding shouldn't result in a 10% devaluation of the vessel. Just keep the deposit. The buyers responsible for the actions of his surveyor.
Arcb, I'm not looking for an argument here. It's how I feel, and I didn't get to be this cynical overnight. It happened because of a string of bad experiences

One guy was so inept I've had to show knowledgeable friends the inspection report to get them to believe me.

And honestly if it meant losing a sale I was OK with that. With the recent sale of our home it turned out to be a good thing as I was able to answer a lot of questions for the buyer who is a first time homeowner, and he can reach out to me after the sale. I would extend the same courtesy to someone buying our boat.

Currently Boatless

The sail, the play of its pulse so like our own lives: so thin and yet so full of life, so noiseless when it labors hardest, so noisy and impatient when least effective." - Henry David Thoreau
JimMcGee is offline  
Reply

Tags
buying , surveyor

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Marine Surveyors pjs1554 General Discussion (sailing related) 3 06-28-2015 09:16 AM
Marine Surveyors in CT, MA, RI Grand River Raider Boat Review and Purchase Forum 4 07-20-2011 11:26 PM
Marine surveyors Ft. Lauderdale GypsyPaula Boat Review and Purchase Forum 2 01-27-2011 08:43 AM
Marine surveyors in southern Maine klem General Discussion (sailing related) 4 10-20-2009 08:57 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome