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Looking to purchase- advice

4K views 38 replies 11 participants last post by  Jeff_H 
#1 · (Edited)
It is time to start evaluating boats for potential purchase. My requirements are unusual and not solely based on performance. I have a triple axle sailboat trailer that can carry up to 15K lbs. The trailer is 32ft long so it can maybe take a boat up to 35ft. I really like the idea of bringing the boat home once and a while for a refit. This limits me to a beam of 10ft or less to stay in the DOT "wide load" permit for most states. The criteria for a boat would be:
1- Beam 10ft or less
2- 32-35 ft
3- less than 15k lbs.
4-encapsulated keel
5-Good tankage
So far on my list is the Cal34, Pearson 35 and Vangaurd, Alberg 35, Ericson 35, Ranger 33.
I cannot find a list of boats based on dimension and weight so any ideas would be appreciated,Cheers
 
#3 ·
I don't know all the boats you mentioned intimately but don't think they will have particularly good tankage. They are all coastal cruisers with likely 25-gallon fuel tanks. Boats over 8.5 ft will require a wide load permit and a wide load permit will get you to 12 feet with some restrictions, not sure you would want to limit yourself to 10 feet. If your intention is just to trailer it home for offseason storage or to work on the boat, you don't need to worry about the wide load restrictions of each state. You may be able to trailer a boat of this size but these are not trailer-able boats. You will likely need a crane, and a days worth of work and a wallet full of 100 dollar bills to pull your boat out of the water and the same to launch it, compared to that effort getting a wide load permit is easy.

Lots of boats to compare here.
The Alajuela 33 Sailboat : Bluewaterboats.org
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the links. The reason for the maximum 10ft beam is because widths over 10 ft requires you to have safety cars with orange flashing lights fore and aft of the wide load trailer. That takes 3 people instead of just one to transport. 10 ft seems like the magic number for most states.
Also, I wouldn't want to put the boat on the hard every year, just every few years for maintenance. I believe a travel lift can place the boat on a trailer just as easy as it can place it on stands. Then for few dollars more have a crane un-step the mast, then head down the road.
 
#7 ·
Thanks for the links. The reason for the maximum 10ft beam is because widths over 10 ft requires you to have safety cars with orange flashing lights fore and aft of the wide load trailer. That takes 3 people instead of just one to transport. 10 ft seems like the magic number for most states.
Double check your stats on that. I just did a transport on a wide load boat and had did some research on wide load needs. At least in the west I believe you only need safety vehicles above 12 feet. If your plan is to only transport it every 3 years or so, I would not let a small thing like needing support vehicles to dictate the boat's beam. If you live near the ocean you could hire two Uber drivers to support your transport home.
 
#5 ·
8.5 is ideal for trailering, but a 28ft or less is just too small for the family. I have been on a Cape Dory 28 with a family of 4 and we were in each others way all the time. Overnighting was too much for the wife. She was a little better with the Cal34 but still angry with the tight squeeze.
 
#9 ·
So the wide load permit states that if over 10ft one safety driver required. If over 12ft two safety drivers are required. If over 10ft- operation in daylight hours only. If over 12ft- operation in daylight hours only and Sunday prohibited. This is why I think 10ft or less is ideal since I will be far from the coast. I realize different rules for different states, so that comes into play as well.
 
#11 ·
Pretty much over 8.5 feet requires a wide load permit, which are not hard to get. My S2 7.9 at only 26 feet is 9 feet wide so requires a wide load permit. The hardest part was figuring out how to tie the wide load signs and install flags on the vehicle at its widest point.

Limiting yourself to under 8.5 feet or under 10 feet will either limit your boat length or your boat choices to a very small selection.
 
#12 ·
Wide load permits are easy to acquire and can be completed online. An additional safety driver was the fly in the soup and that is why I limited myself to 10 feet beam. This still puts me into the 35ft boat range which is spacious enough for a family of four. The other limiting factor was 15k lbs for the trailer. This still produces a good selection of boats. I just need more ideas on which boats fit those limitations. I can see the logic in getting a larger vessel and allowing a commercial carrier to take care of the situation, but for the moment I have this nice trailer and I would like to explore its potential.
 
#13 ·
It
1- Beam 10ft or less
2- 32-35 ft
3- less than 15k lbs.
4-encapsulated keel
5-Good tankage
So far on my list is the Cal34, Pearson 35 and Vangaurd, Alberg 35, Ericson 35, Ranger 33.
I cannot find a list of boats based on dimension and weight so any ideas would be appreciated,Cheers
A couple quick comments, I don't know Canada or all of the state's trucking rules, but my boat was professionally shipped into Maryland from Maine. She is slightly less than 12-0 wide and the carrier did not need a wide load chase car, he only needed a wide load permit.

Also you mentioned wanting an encapsulated keel. Quite a few of the boats on your list have bolt on keels. Those boats on your list that do have encapsulated keels are quite up in years, so you need to be very careful with those. Over time there is a tendency for the ballast keel to delaminate from the encapsulation envelope. Encapsulated keel boats of that era do not have internal framing to support the keel's side loads and so counted on the bond between the ballast keel and the encapsulation envelope for load distribution in a hard grounding. With the bond broken there is less strength and the turn of the bilge into the keel encapsulation envelope is subjected to higher cyclical loading which can cause fatigue over time and further greatly weaken the Hull's resistance to a grounding or a collision with a hard submerged object.

You can find a huge amount of data on most models that have been built on Sailboatdata.com.

Good hunting,
Jeff
 
#14 ·
One word.....Nor'sea 27. Yes but 27 is a number, not a word. Less than 15k pounds (about 8500 or so), encapsulated keel, 8 foot beam, she will fit on your trailer, several have been around the world, 50 gallons water, 27 gallons fuel. She has a way of stepping the mast unaided by the yard, about 4 foot draft. And she is pretty. Consider overall height on the trailer because of gas station awnings and low hanging wires.
 
#15 ·
Thank you Jeff_H for your well thought out response. Admittedly, I am not familiar with the details of interstate transport. Most of my concern is based on the limitations of this sailboat trailer. Your observations on encapsulated keel has me reevaluating my position. I shy away from keel bolts due to a previous acquaintance who's keel bolts had wasted away and could not be replaced. The corrective action was to install lag bolts in between the wasted bolts. I was not satisfied with this repair. I know that not all boats are created equal and some manufactures made provisions for replacement. I would consider these as potential purchases. If you have some boats in mind with easily replaceable keel bolts and are robust please advise. My budget for initial purchase is modest at 35K US currency with additional in reserve for refit. Cheers
 
#21 ·
If you have some boats in mind with easily replaceable keel bolts and are robust please advise.
Buy a Beneteau with an iron keel, replacing the bolts is a standard maintenance procedure, and they'll sell you a kit.

Any boat with an lead keel will have J-shaped studs embedded in the lead and require a heck of a lot more work to replace them in a way that is as strong as the original.
 
#22 ·
"sailboats that are in unusual situations"
An expensive road trip with the trailer just to lay eyes on it, and find out maybe what you have. And a similar long trip home once you find out what it really is or isn't. Not that there aren't pots of gold at the end of the rainbow, but "unusual" boats usually mean someone sin't mentioning how extensive the damages are. Estate sales of half-completed project boats, all sorts of oddities that usually, once you price them out, will not be bargains.
But good luck with the hunt.
 
#25 ·
Here is the thing, with boats there are no silver bullets or always true statements. Like most things about boats every decision is a compromise.
Not all Beneteaus have iron keels
Not all Beneteaus with iron keels have easily replaceable keel bolts.
Iron keels typically come with some mix of less stability, poorer motion comfort and/or poorer sailing performance.
Not all lead keels have J-Bolts
Not all boats with lead Keels and J-bolts have keel bolts that are hard to replace. (You drill new holes and nut pockets just the way lead keels were built before J-bolts were invented, and if you go back with Monel nuts and bolts you will never have to replace them again)
Boats with iron keels that may have steel keel bolts that may be easier and cheaper to replace, typically need their keel
bolts replaced on a more frequent basis (10-to 15 years) vs lead keels with stainless steel bolts(25 to 40 years)
Boats with lead keels and monel keel bolts, pretty much never need their keel bolts replaced.
 
#26 ·
Head spinning, can't think, where did I leave my beer? Was it monel keel with lead bolts or was it lead keel with candy canes? Has anybody seen the door? That light at the end of the tunnel is starting to look like an encapsulated lead keel again. There I was shopping for a Beneteau and now I am back to a Cal34. The one thing I really want to avoid is manufactured obsolescence. Repair-ability is as important to me as functionality. Forget the keel, I'm gonna buy a Corsair Marine F27 trimaran!
 
#28 ·
I'm sorry, but it's nutzo to block out the world's largest producer of boats because you have heard some story from - not even a friend but - an acquaintance.

An oyster sank when it's keel fell off. Wipe all Oysters off the list?
Catalinas have sunk. Wipe them out?
Hunters sink. Chop them off?
Cape Dories have caught fire... Scrap them?

What vehicle do you drive? Power steering can fail so do you only drive a vehicle without power steering?

Your fears do not stack up against any risk analysis. Look for a boat you and your family will like to be aboard and have family fun time.

BTW I can not see family fun time including a narrow boat parked in the back yard.

Sorry to be critical.

Mark
 
#27 ·
Airfares are cheap, only drive the trailer out after the deal's closed.

A mini-survey by a trusted experienced sailor if not a pro, would be ideal, prior to committing to airfare.

These overheads just need to be factored in if you're casting your net wider in search of "the one" and have exhausted more local options.
 
#32 ·
Jeff_H, I agree with everything you've said so far. Personally, I don't like long overhangs. They just seem so inefficient based on gaming CCA rules. Talk about playing to your weakness instead of your strengths. And yes, my boat choices are all over the spectrum from a biplane to a mustang. Different horses for different courses. A P51 makes a lousy crop duster, a biplane makes a lousy bomber support aircraft..etc. Unfortunately with the trailer limitations, my basic requirements are based on beam, weight, length, and $$. Not necessarily performance oriented. Keel choices are a secondary issue, but I would like to get a modern designed boat. Alas, there is that $ issue that narrows the available boats so I will have to compromise on everything. Replaceable keel bolts would be nice though. I could just ditch the trailer also.
 
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