2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake - Page 127 - SailNet Community
 1253Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1261 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
4arch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 937
Thanks: 2
Thanked 34 Times in 31 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

My boat's previous owner installed a combo inverter/charger and I hate it. When you unplug from shore power it automatically switches to invert. We have to remember to manually turn off the inverter function when we unplug or else the thing just sits there drawing about 1.5 amps parasitic load. We very rarely use the inverter - maybe a handful of times to use the microwave at anchor and that's it. But with a propane stove that's hardly a necessity. I'd just as soon have no inverter at all. All our other electronics including TV, phones, and tablets we've set up to run/charge off the 12 volt system.
punahougirl84 likes this.

s/v Spindrift
Beneteau Oceanis 400
formerly Lippincott 30

Last edited by 4arch; 08-23-2016 at 08:29 AM.
4arch is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1262 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
TakeFive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Swarthmore, PA
Posts: 5,171
Thanks: 31
Thanked 149 Times in 137 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Quote:
Originally Posted by punahougirl84 View Post
...I'm certainly hoping to keep this boat for many years. So I'd rather do it right now, whatever we do, than use half measures.

Our current unit is a 2000W inverter and 100amp charger. Since we won't be able to rely on the Xantrex like we thought, I'm returning the weaker charger and have to get a stronger one, and the inverter, and the two remotes, or a combo and one remote. I have to get it shipped so I can get it installed really soon.

If I can't charge the batteries, I can't use the DC stuff, and with no shore power, I can't use the AC stuff either! We do have things like iPads, iPods, phones... along with a couple fans (none of the DC fans are useful yet - we are working on that). The lights are all DC and most of them are LEDs. We plan to get all our nav lights switched over to LEDs too.

I know I can head down and run the engine to charge the batteries. Keep the bilge pump going. The wind generator isn't hooked up as far as we can tell so that won't help.

Trust me, I don't want to be rushed into this. But if the Xantrex is dead, I don't have any choice....
There is a frantic, "gotta have it now" tone to your message that is unnecessary. I think you need to SLOW DOWN and GO SAILING.

There are so many issues here that I don't even know where to start.

First, I'm not convinced that your current charger/inverter is bad. It could be your batteries, or your wiring, or a ground fault or loop. You could waste a bunch of money on a new charger/inverter and end up with the same problem when you're done.

Was your motor running when you tried your inverter? I've always been told not to run an inverter (or electric windlass) off of batteries without the alternator supplementing the power. I suspect that switching on your huge inverter might have pulled the voltage down on the batteries too much, which set off all your warning lights. But that's just a guess - there are SO MANY other things that could have caused your problem that are not the inverter.

You really should follow Dave's advice to simplify things to get you through the rest of the season, and plan out a more thorough diagnosis and, if needed, upgrade to be done over the winter.

What would I do? I would take my automotive charger down to the boat and get the batteries charging for the time being. At this point I'd do this for the rest of the season if needed. Just take care to remove the charger when the batteries are fully charged, since automatic sensing of full charge state is where cheap chargers often fall short. You really don't want to end up PSOC issues on the batteries, so get them charging now. I'd keep doing this interim step until I have a permanent solution worked out.

What else would I do? I would build up a better 12v infrastructure on the boat. You really have NO NEED for an inverter for just weekending on a boat. Charging phones and computers off of 12v is far more efficient than inverting from 12vDC to 120vAC, only to have your power bricks convert it back to 12vDC. So I'd install a few 12v automotive connectors in convenient locations and use them for this very low power charging of devices. As an interim step, Battery Tender has very nice cords with fuses built-in that could attach direct to a battery and provide a 12v socket on a pigtail. It's not marine grade but it will get you through the season. I know people here say everything needs to be hardwired, but for temporary and transient use I would consider it good enough. (Others here may disagree.)

I'd also buy a few lithium ion battery packs that can supply backup USB power to your devices. Keep them charged up, and they can power your phones and iPads over a weekend. I gave these things to everyone in my family as stocking stuffers last year. ($6 each at Staples on black Friday) Also buy automotive plug-in 12v chargers for your laptops.

I would also buy a jump charger from the auto department. These usually have a 12v socket and a couple USB sockets, in addition to the jump cables for starting cars with dead batteries. These can power all your devices for a weekend, and you never know when you might need it to start your diesel. I have two of these, and end up using them several times a year. I use one to power my CPAP on 12v overnight, because the long wire run to a 12v outlet causes too much voltage drop for it to start up reliably. I also use them every winter when the boat is on the hard and the house batteries are disconnected.

I think you're too obsessed with having a big inverter on this boat. My current boat came with a brand new 50w/1000w Magnum charger/inverter, and I have yet to even turn on the inverter. Hopefully my surveyor tested it, because I haven't. I just didn't care that much about it during survey. Do you realize that a 2000w inverter will draw up to 170 amps from your batteries? That's more than most electric windlasses, and will really test the quality of your batteries.

With a decent 12v infrastructure, you could get by without an inverter. Even with an inverter, you should not be running it constantly, only for short spurts when you want the microwave or TV. My TV only draws 19-25 watts, so I could use a little portable inverter for it instead of the big Magnum house inverter.

Which reminds me - you really should get a Kill-a-Watt meter and determine how much power each of your AC devices draws in real world conditions. That, more than anything, will inform you around whether you need an inverter, and how big it needs to be.

I think for a couple hundred dollars you could buy a nice automotive charger, jump charger, a few battery packs, and some 12v sockets, and get through the season without spending a few thousand that may not solve your problem. Even if you eventually get an inverter, all of these items will have enduring value around the house and on the boat in the future.

Deferring the permanent work also allows you to shop around for specials at the boat show.
chef2sail and punahougirl84 like this.

Rick S., Swarthmore, PA
USCG Certified Captain, OUPV and 50 Ton Master
ASA Certified 101/103/104/105/106



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2001 Catalina 34MkII Tall Rig Wing Keel Breakin' Away, Universal Diesel M35B, Mantus 35 lb. anchor, sailing out of Rock Hall, MD
TakeFive is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to TakeFive For This Useful Post:
punahougirl84 (08-24-2016)
post #1263 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
chef2sail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 11,616
Thanks: 131
Thanked 245 Times in 237 Posts
Rep Power: 13
 
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Like Rick I think the complexity of your system may be its downfall. Break it into seperate components. You need to keep that battery bank charged. 11 years on that old Xantrex your living on borrowed time.

I would not use an auto charger as it doesn't three stage it and might fry the batteries. Besides you want to continuously charge the last 15% to prevent shortening the batteries deep cycle life.

Hook up the mastervolt. That assures that we you use the boat the batteries are charged . That's will let you go sailing. You have lights. Your bilge will work as will your refrigeration! At the dock the shore power will continuously charge the batteries which 98% of your stuff runs on

Like I said before your mastervolt 40 is what we have had for years and is plenty strong enough to go sailing

I would wait until you develops a well thought out integrated plan this winter accessing your REAL world electrical needs. Read up on and familiarize yourself with this very expensive part of the boat. Your not cruisers yet. It will take you a couple years to learn your boat. Then you can make educated decisions and choices. Right now it seems you are in a fix everything mode. Easy does it and get some sailing in.

You started late this year getting this boat ready. Dependent on marine contractors. You seem to have some knowledge and like of racing. Apply it to learning about and contemplating long range plans for repairing and upgrading Kalima . You seem to be in a frenzy to fix everything
Right now and you will waste thousands. Rick gave you good advice.mgo sailing....slow down a little. This isn't a short term race or thing but a long term plan for you and the family. Be measured and learn to fix some of this yourself

GO Sailing. 12 weeks left
punahougirl84 likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
chef2sail is online now  
 
post #1264 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
punahougirl84's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Maryland
Posts: 241
Thanks: 63
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Thanks all!

I've copied all these notes. I had actually thought about boat show specials-thanks for the reminder! We are going to install a charger and take more time to figure out all the rest. We do have back-up battery packs for the electronics, but they all need to be charged too.

The AC is for outlets (one set in each cabin, one at the nav station, one in the main head), the hot water heater (which I do understand can be heated with the engine), and the microwave. I've never had a boat with a microwave or hot water heater or outlets. Seemed so cool at the time. I know we can at least use them at the dock once we have a functioning charger that passes the AC through.

We do have plans to get out more so I'm just trying to do things right the first time and avoid the jury-rigging that can happen but I don't want to mess anything up so we'll take baby steps. I'm certainly not interested in spending heaps of dough on stuff I don't need. I just don't necessarily know what I'll need a couple years down the line.

Except for sails. I love to race and I'm definitely going to get new sails. When there's a SALE! Dad had sent me a link for North (the North guys raced with us back home). But I'm going to do some research there too.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
A racing sailor in search of new adventures for her family!
s/v Kaimana, 1984 Beneteau First 38
punahougirl84 is offline  
post #1265 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
The most female moderator
 
Donna_F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: SE Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,910
Thanks: 148
Thanked 303 Times in 274 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Dock
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Quote:
Originally Posted by punahougirl84 View Post
Thanks all!
...

We do have plans to get out more so I'm just trying to do things right the first time and avoid the jury-rigging that can happen but I don't want to mess anything up so we'll take baby steps. I'm certainly not interested in spending heaps of dough on stuff I don't need. I just don't necessarily know what I'll need a couple years down the line.

...
Then if possible, worry about it then. By then you'll have spent some time on your new boat and will know more precisely what you want to change and you'll spend less time agonizing over what to buy because you'll know exactly what you want.

We made a heap of changes this year but we're six years into owning it. After buying the boat we sailed. We took notes while we sailed. I took notes over the winters when the boat was laid up. We prioritized and installed the most immediate safety-related things but otherwise what was the hurry? Our dodger and bimini weren't the prettiest on the bay but they did the job (replaced this season), we didn't have an anchor light (an option the first owners didn't buy) but got by with a portable light we raised up the mast. New dusk to dawn anchor light, steaming light and deck light went in over the winter when we had our mast taken down to rewire and get new rigging.

You're making me exhausted reading your posts!

Donna


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Catalina 30 TRBS
Rock Hall, MD
KB3ZCB

If you're helping someone and expecting something in return, you're doing business not kindness.
Donna_F is offline  
post #1266 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
punahougirl84's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Maryland
Posts: 241
Thanks: 63
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donna_F View Post
Then if possible, worry about it then. By then you'll have spent some time on your new boat and will know more precisely what you want to change and you'll spend less time agonizing over what to buy because you'll know exactly what you want.

We made a heap of changes this year but we're six years into owning it. After buying the boat we sailed. We took notes while we sailed. I took notes over the winters when the boat was laid up. We prioritized and installed the most immediate safety-related things but otherwise what was the hurry? Our dodger and bimini weren't the prettiest on the bay but they did the job (replaced this season), we didn't have an anchor light (an option the first owners didn't buy) but got by with a portable light we raised up the mast. New dusk to dawn anchor light, steaming light and deck light went in over the winter when we had our mast taken down to rewire and get new rigging.

You're making me exhausted reading your posts!
Sorry about that!

It sounds like you had a great plan and it's working for you. I had prioritized too, made lists... did the safety stuff first, noted what would make the boat sail better... then stuff happened LOL!

We picked up the Davis light to take place of the non-functioning anchor light. And an extension cord since it has to plug in to the nav station.

I figured if the PO had a 2000W/100Amp inverter/charger, then the boat was set up for that and would need that. He sailed to the Caribbean and South America and the boat has done Annapolis to Bermuda. I know we won't be doing all that - but I'd like to do the A2B at some point. The ARC DelMarVa looks fun. And racing. And local cruising. The inverter wouldn't be necessary for lots of stuff. But I can see when it would be.

Meanwhile, I took the last two sails off the boat. The original Elvstrom #1 from 1984 is actually in pretty good condition - no tears, no patches... but it's hank-on and I'm not sure we can use it (we have a double foil furler and I don't think the luff will go up). Wondering if we can Bacon-it. The second sail I pulled off is a disaster (North told the PO it was "shot" back in 1999 - not sure why HE kept it) - a huge mylar foresail that is shredded up from the foot and holed in many places, many times patched, and I have to find out if there's any way to recycle it or use the leftover fabric for anything at all. Rain ponchos maybe. I do sew, and my second job was in a sail loft...


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
A racing sailor in search of new adventures for her family!
s/v Kaimana, 1984 Beneteau First 38

Last edited by punahougirl84; 08-23-2016 at 06:20 PM.
punahougirl84 is offline  
post #1267 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
travlin-easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Maryland - USA
Posts: 6,647
Thanks: 2
Thanked 131 Times in 110 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

I think my next project, and there always seems to be a next one, will be to install a hard-top Bimini, one that will hold a couple solar panels safely, yet, still have the ability to attach my full enclosure and dodger when I want to use them. I had a Tee top on several powerboats and I loved it. I'm tired of my old canvas, which now resembles a starlit night when you look up on a sunny day. When it rains, well, it's like a fine shower-head.

This will take my solar panel off the stern rail, which will prevent me from accidentally bumping it into the pier piling at low tide while docking. Also will provide me with the ability to fight bigger fish off the stern, when I catch them. That's my plan for this coming winter.

Still have to find that damned leak in the cabin top - it tends to elude me every time I try to find it. Maybe tomorrow will be the day.

Cheers,

Gary
chef2sail and punahougirl84 like this.
travlin-easy is online now  
post #1268 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016
Senior Member
 
chef2sail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 11,616
Thanks: 131
Thanked 245 Times in 237 Posts
Rep Power: 13
 
Send a message via AIM to chef2sail
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Quote:
Originally Posted by punahougirl84 View Post
Sorry about that!

It sounds like you had a great plan and it's working for you. I had prioritized too, made lists... did the safety stuff first, noted what would make the boat sail better... then stuff happened LOL!

We picked up the Davis light to take place of the non-functioning anchor light. And an extension cord since it has to plug in to the nav station.

I figured if the PO had a 2000W/100Amp inverter/charger, then the boat was set up for that and would need that. He sailed to the Caribbean and South America and the boat has done Annapolis to Bermuda. I know we won't be doing all that - but I'd like to do the A2B at some point. The ARC DelMarVa looks fun. And racing. And local cruising. The inverter wouldn't be necessary for lots of stuff. But I can see when it would be.

Meanwhile, I took the last two sails off the boat. The original Elvstrom #1 from 1984 is actually in pretty good condition - no tears, no patches... but it's hank-on and I'm not sure we can use it (we have a double foil furler and I don't think the luff will go up). Wondering if we can Bacon-it. The second sail I pulled off is a disaster (North told the PO it was "shot" back in 1999 - not sure why HE kept it) - a huge mylar foresail that is shredded up from the foot and holed in many places, many times patched, and I have to find out if there's any way to recycle it or use the leftover fabric for anything at all. Rain ponchos maybe. I do sew, and my second job was in a sail loft...
My wife made many things from our used sails
Duffle bags, rolling suitcase bags, an awnings g at home,
Winch covers, and lastly a hatch tent. This was the most creative as we can put it over the front hatch, the biggest hatch on most boats, when it rains so we can keep it open in the biggest deluge. It has a loop in the middle we attach to the spinnaker halyard and lift it up to a tent.
The four corners have loops for bungee cords which attach to our perforated toe rail.

So many are giving you the same advice hear. We want to hear about your families sailing escapades. That's a great legacy to leave them. My daughter who grew up on a sailboat now at 35 has purchased a 27 Catalina of her own. She was "forced" to "endure" weekends and trips on my sailboat growing up. We didn't ask her as she'd have said no of course. We just did it and she grew up in that lifestyle. Yes she had activities but not she didn't have the option of not doing family stuff.

Hopefully your next post is about Rock Hall or that you've anchored in some awesome creek you've heard us talk about.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
___________________________
S/V Haleakala (Hawaiian for" House of the Sun")
C&C 35 MKIII Hull # 76
Parkville, Maryland
(photos by Joe McCary)
Charter member of the Chesapeake Lion posse

Our blog-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


“Sailing is just the bottom line, like adding up the score in bridge. My real interest is in the tremendous game of life.”- Dennis Conner
chef2sail is online now  
post #1269 of 1896 Old 08-23-2016 Thread Starter
Mermaid Hunter
 
SVAuspicious's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: on the boat - Chesapeake
Posts: 5,687
Thanks: 0
Thanked 275 Times in 246 Posts
Rep Power: 14
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

A little different but definitely Chesapeake:

The South Annapolis Yacht Centre development on the property of Petrini's Shipyard and Sarle's Boatyard seems to be moving forward. The drawings I have seen look really nice. It will be a major upgrade to Spa Creek.

Wandering around the property the other day I realized that the old marine railway is something really special. Some poking around and building relationships got me access to the closed boathouse above the railway. The cart, winch, and all the mechanical pieces are all there!

Since I can rarely leave well enough alone I went through my Rolodex and met with the Executive Director and the Curator of the Annapolis Maritime Museum. I've talked with the developer. There are lots and lots of very practical details to work out, but we have an agreement in principal to relocate the railway to the Annapolis Maritime Museum as a display of how working boats were maintained and repaired in the days before Travelifts.

I'm feeling pretty good about this.

sail fast and eat well, dave S/V Auspicious

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

beware "cut and paste" sailors


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
SVAuspicious is offline  
post #1270 of 1896 Old 08-24-2016
Senior Member
 
travlin-easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Maryland - USA
Posts: 6,647
Thanks: 2
Thanked 131 Times in 110 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: 2016 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake

Outstanding sail today, wsw winds averaging about 15 most of the day, some gusts to 20, set the sails, locked the steering, sipped on an ice-cold Coors Light, wolfed down a submarine sandwich, and only ran the engine to get down the Havre de Grace Channel as far as Battery Island, then didn't fire it up again until I was a quarter mile from the marina so I could dock the boat. Most of the time the boat cruised along at 6 to 7.5 MPH, even when I was wing on wing returning up the Havre de Grace Channel. Temperature in the cockpit never got above 81 in the shade of my Highlandtown Bimini.

Looking for a repeat tomorrow,

Gary (the retired sailor0
travlin-easy is online now  
Reply

Tags
alberg 35 , anchor

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2015 Sailing Season on the Chesapeake SVAuspicious Chesapeake Bay 434 01-03-2016 05:29 PM
N.L. sailing team sets sights on 2016 Olympics NewsReader News Feeds 0 09-10-2013 05:50 PM
Sailing: Windsurfing reinstated for Rio 2016 NewsReader News Feeds 0 11-10-2012 11:50 PM
Singapore sailing outlines plans for 2016 Rio Olympics NewsReader News Feeds 0 07-31-2011 02:10 PM
Is the Chesapeake sailing season beginning? teshannon Cruising & Liveaboard Forum 41 12-23-2007 12:44 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome