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post #481 of 495 Old 02-04-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

I bet I made this point hundreds of posts ago, but I'm not going to try to find it.

Island Packet is not a contemporary design, but it definitely has a following. I would even say a cult following. Some people have a hard time understanding what other's actually like, especially if it's not the current trend.

It's true, they are not selling enough new boats (relatively cheap, with 5 yr thru hulls, is what is selling new). I will offer the theory that they build such a solid product and have sold so many over the years, the cult can find quality used product that has stood up much longer than many other brands. I'm saying overall, not everything about them. Planned obsolescence was not their business model and it may be biting them now.

I'm not trying to sell or defend IP, they're not my cup of tea. For their niche, they're highly desirable.


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post #482 of 495 Old 02-04-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

[QUOTE=smackdaddy;2051371866]I was looking at the Seaward 26 (at $98K)...

...compared to something like the Beneteau Oceanis 31 (at $123K)...

- or even the First 25 (at $72K)..

.../QUOTE]

I don't know what would be a fair comparison, but I don't think this is one. If you try to use the Seaward for what the First is designed for, you end up with people pointing at the Seaward and laughing as the First disappears over the horizon. But if you try to use the First for what the Seaward was designed for, people are soon pointing at the First and laughing as the towboat tries to free it from the mud.

I've never sailed either of them, so my comments aren't worth much. Even so, I've been aboard a exemplar of each at a boat show. I don't know if it's actually built better, but the Seaward had a nicer fit and finish to it than the Beneteau.
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post #483 of 495 Old 02-04-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

I don't see how a Seaward 26 rk is in any way competing with the two Beneteaus listed above. I would say it might be in competition with something like the TES Magnam or 720. Not the same ballpark as a 31 foot Oceanis, not even the same game. Entirely different market, entirely different purpose.

TES 28 Magnam ? Tes-Yacht

Tes 678 Bt-Tes 720 ? Tes-Yacht
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post #484 of 495 Old 02-04-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
That is because there is no "proprietary" gelcoat. IP does not, and never has, manufactured gelcoat. The companies that make gelcoat may make a "proprietary" color, but not a base gel coat. IP may use higher quality gelcoat than some (I don't know), but it certainly isn't unique to them.
Mark
I beg to disagree. Island Packet at one time acquired a very innovative company that pioneered vinylester resin usage in boat manufacturing, - Arjay Industries. This is where fiberglass components and technique currently used by Island Packet came from as per Bob Johnson (Good]Good Old Boat - Welcome to Good Old Boat Magazine Old Boat - Oct. 2004 Island Packet Interview):

"...the same firm that worked for Hutchins, Arjay Industries, did glass work for us. I wound up buying the assets of that company, it was right across the street, and I brought it all over, people, equipment, everything . . . and he got out of the lamination business. Our glasswork was overdue to be brought in-house, from the standpoint of the type of control we wanted to exercise over it. Bob Cottrell, owner of Arjay Industries, was not your basic glass business owner, he was a Harvard MBA and a chemical engineer, and he took a very methodical approach to fiberglass construction. One of the things he developed was a spray core decking material that eliminates foam or balsa or plywood. You get the Oreo cookie concept of glass, lightweight filler and more glass. We won't use it on the hull because it reduces puncture and impact resistance, but it makes for a very stiff, lightweight deck. On the hull we use fiberglass, one laminate after another. We bought that technology also and brought it over as well. So we have a 10-year warranty on our deck against rot or delamination. No one else can do that, balsa and plywood core decks will eventually deteriorate. Some other companies do spray core also, but I don't know who they are; but there is a company out there that sells a similar process (ours is a home-built process, internally developed). If you buy a 15-year old Island Packet, you will not have that core material rot. It can't. It's microspheres in resin. It will be just as good as the glass around it."

Next time you walk around in a marina, - do yourself a favor. Find any 20 years old chlorox bottle boat and compare gelcoat condition to a 20 years old Island Packet. Then draw a conclusion...
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post #485 of 495 Old 02-05-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rostyvyg View Post
I beg to disagree. Island Packet at one time acquired a very innovative company that pioneered vinylester resin usage in boat manufacturing, - Arjay Industries. This is where fiberglass components and technique currently used by Island Packet came from as per Bob Johnson (Good]Good Old Boat - Welcome to Good Old Boat Magazine Old Boat - Oct. 2004 Island Packet Interview):

"...the same firm that worked for Hutchins, Arjay Industries, did glass work for us. I wound up buying the assets of that company, it was right across the street, and I brought it all over, people, equipment, everything . . . and he got out of the lamination business. Our glasswork was overdue to be brought in-house, from the standpoint of the type of control we wanted to exercise over it. Bob Cottrell, owner of Arjay Industries, was not your basic glass business owner, he was a Harvard MBA and a chemical engineer, and he took a very methodical approach to fiberglass construction. One of the things he developed was a spray core decking material that eliminates foam or balsa or plywood. You get the Oreo cookie concept of glass, lightweight filler and more glass. We won't use it on the hull because it reduces puncture and impact resistance, but it makes for a very stiff, lightweight deck. On the hull we use fiberglass, one laminate after another. We bought that technology also and brought it over as well. So we have a 10-year warranty on our deck against rot or delamination. No one else can do that, balsa and plywood core decks will eventually deteriorate. Some other companies do spray core also, but I don't know who they are; but there is a company out there that sells a similar process (ours is a home-built process, internally developed). If you buy a 15-year old Island Packet, you will not have that core material rot. It can't. It's microspheres in resin. It will be just as good as the glass around it."

Next time you walk around in a marina, - do yourself a favor. Find any 20 years old chlorox bottle boat and compare gelcoat condition to a 20 years old Island Packet. Then draw a conclusion...
No, you are wrong about the gelcoat. Arjay Industries never manufactured gelcoat (and do not - they are still in business after being spun back out). Even your quote from that article does not mention gelcoat - just the glasswork lamination itself, the tooling, and a custom syntactic foam used for coring material (they still manufacture that syntactic foam, although it is mostly used for transom repairs).

While I agree that IP probably used a high-quality gelcoat, it was not proprietary and was available to other manufactures - some who also used it.

Before I am accused of running down IP's just because I am presenting facts, please believe that I have no beef with IP or their designs at all (I even pointed out some of their innovations above). The original 26 is one of my favorite designs.

Mark

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post #486 of 495 Old 02-10-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

Just saw this open house on my sail magazine today.


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post #487 of 495 Old 02-12-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

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Just saw this open house on my sail magazine today.


I think you meant to attach something or include a link here... right?
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post #488 of 495 Old 02-12-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

If anything I would guess the price of the older Island Packets will go up. Look at it this way, - the factory survived and is ramping up the production but it will take a long time (if ever) for them to be able to build 2 new boats each week as they were able to do before 2008 recession. Meanwhile, they are around to provide support (parts, plans, advise, etc.) to the current boat owners and they literally go out of their way to accommodate IP owners needs. They introduced several factory refit programs (brilliant move) and are able to rebuild and restore any older IP to a like new cruising ready condition. So with lack of new Island Packets on the market if someone wants a modern full keel cruising boat their options are limited to buying a used Island Packet or buying some really old full keel yacht and spending tons of money and, most crucially, a lot of time trying to refit it to meet their needs. It's either spending money upfront (and being able to finance it) or spending time and money later (and having to pay cash for refit).

BTW, the only way to understand what an IP is about is to spend quite some time on one in a variety of conditions. Crew on one, make a delivery, charter one for two weeks, own one ... It is really not fair to sail it for one day and draw some long reaching conclusion...

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post #489 of 495 Old 02-12-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

Every time I dingy back to my IP460 I fall in love again. At least once a week I tell my wife how lucky we were to find her. Not sure if everyone feels the same about their boats.
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post #490 of 495 Old 02-12-2018
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Re: Island Packet Closing Doors?

Eder said it. Love the one you're with!! (little musical reference there. )

My taste runs to Catalinas, and I just happen to own one. Go figure. I've got two dock mates that have Island Packets, and they just LOVE their boats. I personally agree with a previous post that said their wife pointed out that all sailboats are slow. Boating is as much emotional as it is practical. IPs make great boats, and the idea that the factory is supporting re-fits is very smart. Hope they have a great run!!


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