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post #21 of 31 Old 02-13-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

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Originally Posted by Lpdiver View Post
...My wife suffers from terrible sea sickness; according to her, pretty mild from my view.....
Not going to be snarky, but just suggesting you treat this like it is terrible, not mild. Seems you are, as you’re looking for solutions. Does she want solutions, or would she prefer not to do this? No drug will fully make this a non-issue. Most won’t work, after symptoms begin and it can’t be healthy to take them every day.

The scopolamine patch is generally considered the most effective, but does have side effects. If your wife tolerates it well, as the last post implies, why not stick with it? In high doses, it is used by criminals because the victim does not present any inebriation, but is also unaware of what they are doing and fully compliant. Executives in Columbia were seen on security video withdrawing money from ATMs or giving bank instructions the criminal instructed them to. They woke up (if they didn’ overdose) with no recollection.

In small doses, short term memory loss is a common side effect. I cruised with a friend that asked me the same question 4 times in a row. It was bizarre. He had no recollection of the question just seconds earlier. Never, ever apply a second patch, if the first isn’t working. Unless hallucinating, however, you may not be able to tell that your wife is having side effects and she many not remember. Very weird drug.

Another drug is sturgeron (spelling?). Not available in the US, but I understand it is in Canada. However, it is believed it could contribute to developing Parkinson’s in one’s elder years. Even if that one in a thousand, those odds are too high for me.

Living on seasickness drugs is not a great solution. Hopefully, her anxiety will subside and this will cure itself. It will only happen if she wants it to.


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Last edited by Minnewaska; 02-13-2019 at 05:25 AM.
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post #22 of 31 Old 02-13-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Mal de mer

Minnewaska,

You are absolutely right. I am treating it with high priorities as this issue is the most likely to derail my plans. I don't want to drop a bundle of cash and then have to cash out due to her not enjoying life on board. The real litmus test is a few long vacations on boats before purchase.

Thanks for you response.
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post #23 of 31 Old 02-13-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

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Another drug is sturgeron (spelling?). Not available in the US, but I understand it is in Canada.
Nope. Anyone I know who has it got it in Mexico. AFAIK gravol is the only seasickness medication available in Canada. It's actually pretty annoying.

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post #24 of 31 Old 02-14-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

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Nope. Anyone I know who has it got it in Mexico. AFAIK gravol is the only seasickness medication available in Canada. It's actually pretty annoying.
Are you sure? I thought I recalled some folks I knew used to cross the Great Lakes to get some, so I just tried to look it up online. Seems the Canadian online pharmacies offer it. At least Canada is in the name, so I assume they’re in Canada.

https://www.canadapharmacy.com/products/stugeron

Some swear by it, but I suspect it’s about the same as any psychosomatic benefit. If you believe something will work for seasickness, I’m sure it will. I also noticed that the Parkinson related symptom was determined to go away, when the drug was discontinued. At last most of the time. Still may not be good enough for me.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9613736

Finally, I also noticed that Bonine is not sold in Canada, but commonly available in the US. However, I couldn’t find why.


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post #25 of 31 Old 02-14-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
Are you sure? I thought I recalled some folks I knew used to cross the Great Lakes to get some, so I just tried to look it up online. Seems the Canadian online pharmacies offer it. At least Canada is in the name, so I assume they’re in Canada.

https://www.canadapharmacy.com/products/stugeron

Some swear by it, but I suspect it’s about the same as any psychosomatic benefit. If you believe something will work for seasickness, I’m sure it will. I also noticed that the Parkinson related symptom was determined to go away, when the drug was discontinued. At last most of the time. Still may not be good enough for me.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9613736

Finally, I also noticed that Bonine is not sold in Canada, but commonly available in the US. However, I couldn’t find why.

Pretty darn sure. eery reference I find for it says its not available in Canada (except for the online pharmacies which I suspect aren't Canadian). And Like I said, everyone I know who uses it got their stash in Mexico.

Wikipedia: "It is not available in the United States or Canada. It has also been cited as one of the most used drugs for seasickness within the British Royal Navy."

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post #26 of 31 Old 02-14-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

Yeah, the drug restrictions are just bonkers. Yesterday, Antigua. the Wife went into a local drug store and got Sturgerone Forte (70mg - 15mg recommended dose) OTC. No problem.

I’ve lost track of what drugs you are discussing but Scopalomine is deffinetly available in the USA and anada with a prescription.

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post #27 of 31 Old 02-15-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

I believe seasickness on a boat underway can be a huge safety factor. It can lead to severe dehydration. It also can create a burden on the crew if the person is not able to perform sailing or watchstanding tasks. I do caution that seasick meds can interfere with balance, performance and certain medical conditions. For instance, men with an enlarged prostate should be extra careful about taking some seasick meds. Talk with your doctor first. Here's a good article from cruising expert John Neal: http://www.mahina.com/covers/YMseasickness.pdf Note the emphasis on hydration and starting meds well before you cast off.
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post #28 of 31 Old 02-16-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

I’ve posted this elsewhere but here it is again in abbreviated form.
Motion sickness is much more complex than just eyes and ears. There’s a hereditary component. For instance those who are current or past migraine sufferers are much more prone to be seasick. Multiple neurotransmitters are involved including dopamine, norepinephrine, gaba, acetylcholine and importantly histamine.
Most anti motion sickness meds have an antihistaminic (hence risk of sleepiness) component but some also effect dopamine systems (hence risk of Parkinsonism and their being illegal in some countries e.g. sturgeon).
All sensory systems contribute to your awareness of the relationship of your head to gravity and the position of your head,core and limbs. So all are involved in motion sickness. Motion( particularly angular acceration) are measured by your semi circular canals and gravity effect on your head by the utricle and saccule but vision, prioception kinethetic skin imput, Golgi body input and others also contribute. To think of seasickness as just a mismatch between eyes and ears is a gross simplification.
Even your olfactory bodies contribute. You know people who are fine until they smell diesel or go into the head.
There’s a large neurological literature about motion sickness. A quick read is to look at the stuff from NASA and the armed services in recent years.
On the pharmaceutical front as usual look at double blinded trials only. Yes, ginger helps some. Yes, plugging one ear helped in a controlled trial.

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post #29 of 31 Old 02-16-2019
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Re: Mal de mer

Thanks for the scientific overview OB. Much appreciate it.

My partner’s (and hence my) practice is to get her on the helm as soon as she feels any hint of a bout coming on. Part of what she says this alleviates is a sense, or lack, of control. It’s more than simple anticipation of inertial changes … it’s fascinating.

Clearly being out in the open air, with a clear horizon visible, makes a big difference for her. Travelling through fog is hard, although night sailing doesn’t appear to be an issue. Weird. Smells like diesel do make it harder for her. Ginger seems to help. Those wrist bands didn’t.

Does the research you’ve looked at tackle the question of what makes some of us more susceptible, and others less? Are there any gender differences? Women tend to have better senses of smell.

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Re: Mal de mer

Lpd-
It should be mentioned that "get her drunk" contradicts almost all the advice on seasickness. Alcohol, even the night before, is universally said to CAUSE seasickness. As is greasy food, tobacco smoke, diesel fumes, lack of sleep, and a few other things commonly agreed on.

Canada pushes Sturgeron (over the counter) which is illegal in the US. Oral Scopalomine is off the US market entirely, but is sold OTC in the UK and former colonies under the brand name "Kwells" and others. About $5 for 10 ten pills, way cheaper than the 3-day Scop patch we can get in the US. And Scop is very serious medicine, perhaps the most effective and the one with the longest list of serious side effects. Try it AT HOME when there's someone else around "just in case" if she tries it.

There's also the "NASA cocktail", maybe ephedrine and something else I don't recall, available by rx only and the researched choice of NASA, who have spent a lot of time and money looking into motion sickness.

Then there's the electric Relief Band. It applies electric pulses on the nekwan acupressure point over the wrist tendons. Not new age nonsense, not a simple pressure button, but confirmed and approved by the FDA because it does reduce morning sickness during pregnancy. There's something objectively proven that works there. Disposable sealed version, second generation uses coin batteries, new ones are USB rechargeable, all sold along with clones online. I'd go for the USB model these days. I can tell you it is almost as effective as Scop--but you MUST position it very precisely, you can't just slap it on the wrist and expect it to work. And like any meds, start it up on shore before you leave. At the low setting, it is easy to forget. On the high setting...the tingling is distracting and unpleasant, but WAY better than seasickness. I just set it on high, and that way I also know it is still in the correct position and working.
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