What gives you a charge? - Page 5 - SailNet Community
 13Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #41 of 48 Old 05-15-2019
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 19,449
Thanks: 82
Thanked 547 Times in 524 Posts
Rep Power: 11
   
Re: What gives you a charge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
This gives me a charge... Oh and happy belated birthday to my LiFePO4 bank!...
@Maine Sail , 10 years, no loss of capacity. Wow, that is some serious value. I'm willing to bet you take care of them better than the average boater, however. Do you remove and store at home over the winter?

Curious what the dimensions are for 400ah?


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.
Minnewaska is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #42 of 48 Old 05-15-2019
Super Moderator
 
Maine Sail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Maine Coast
Posts: 6,669
Thanks: 31
Thanked 356 Times in 276 Posts
Rep Power: 10
       
Re: What gives you a charge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
You forgot to mention that you have been deeply and continually cycling those cells for the past 10yrs. They have far more full cycles on them than what would be expected on a normal cruising boat over the same time period.

You didn't mention how many times they caught fire, though...

Mark
- Closing in on 1200 cycles (would need to double check my notebook), most of those to right around 80% DOD (this is a boat-load of deep-cycles)

- Only ever back to 100% SOC, when cruising, every 10-20 cycles, in order to keep the Ah counter calibration in-check (just switched from a Link-Pro to the Balmar SG200 to eliminate the Ah counter calibration issues)

- Capacity tested every 50 cycles to 0% SOC

- Once 1000 cycles were attained I switched to every 100 cycles for capacity testing (the cells have been taken to 0% SOC no less than 30 times because we were messing around with "memory effect" testing on some of the test cycles)

- Batteries were only re-balanced once, at around 750 cycles, due to a BMS board glitch (I don't allow our charge voltage to reach balancing level)

- The cells were very well matched from the factory, something that is getting tougher to find today

- The cells have never been floated nor held at a high SOC for very long - we charge, then discharge we don't float, ever...

- The cells have rarely exceeded 85F

- When not in-use they are sitting somewhere between 30% SOC and 50% SOC..

- Charge rate has been about .35C for the last five years or so (solar has been all but turned off unless we need to slow our discharge).

- Just getting the boat ready on the mooring, with the engine warming up, can replenish more than a days worth of energy for us.

- The cells have only ever been charged to a max peak voltage of 13.9 (very short duration) then it drops to 13.8V for about 18 minutes, then OFF.

- At a charge voltage of 13.8V, tapering to about .025C over about 18 minutes or so, we can extract over 400Ah of capacity from the cells.



Oh yes and no fires and the cells rarely if ever exceed more than a 1F differential from ambient temp even when charging at .35C or 35% of Ah capacity.

That said these cells are still pretty easy to damage $$$ if not used / charged correctly...
CVAT likes this.

______
-Maine Sail / CS-36T


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.




© Images In Posts Property of Compass Marine Inc.


Maine Sail is offline  
post #43 of 48 Old 05-17-2019 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
outbound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: NE & Windwards
Posts: 6,053
Thanks: 132
Thanked 179 Times in 172 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Load tested the lifelines. All were “good “ except main engine start. In Clarke’s Court. Can only buy the 800 cca AGM West marine brand here from North. It’s less than the 860 lifeline but should be ok. A couple of hundred and a drop in replacement.
It’s interesting that we have pretty much the same comforts as Mark but get the vast majority of our juice from alt engery which works well with our dc devices. Our ac draw is the ac which is rarely used.
Different way to skin the cat.
Zemurray likes this.

s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46
outbound is online now  
 
post #44 of 48 Old 05-17-2019
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: The Bahamas
Posts: 3,384
Thanks: 3
Thanked 127 Times in 125 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Why not just start from your house bank.
Not buying what you dont want longterm....
RegisteredUser is online now  
post #45 of 48 Old 05-17-2019
Senior Member
 
colemj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: On the boat cruising
Posts: 2,687
Thanks: 3
Thanked 109 Times in 104 Posts
Rep Power: 17
 
Re: What gives you a charge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
Itís interesting that we have pretty much the same comforts as Mark but get the vast majority of our juice from alt engery which works well with our dc devices. Our ac draw is the ac which is rarely used.
Different way to skin the cat.
Just to be clear, we have 855W of solar, to which we are adding another 360W. On our other boat, we have 700W of solar. While we have a generator on both boats, we are putting less than 100hrs/yr on them (probably around 50hrs) - and that is almost all between mid-December to early-Febuary above 23*N, where the days are short and the sun is low. Even then, the only reason we aren't running entirely off batteries is because we have a 30gph AC powered watermaker and keep the water heater hot. I estimated that the other boat would need another 200W of solar to be completely free the full year, and this new boat may be completely free now, but definitely will be with one more panel.

Outside that short period of the year, both of those systems (and one aircon if needed) normally run off the LFP bank through the inverter. Of course, the electric kettle, electric coffee maker, the toaster, the waffle maker, the crockpot, the microwave, and the induction plate also run off the batteries through the inverter. The new boat has two freezers and two refrigerators - none of which are very efficient, but are still within the comfort of the existing solar and battery capacity.

So I'd call what we do as running 99% off alt energy.

Without LFP, I don't think we could run the water heater, water maker, or aircon off lead batteries of any type - those would require a generator. I also estimate we would need much greater battery capacity to run the other stuff. We just dumped 1305Ah of new high end lead batteries off the boat that could not keep up. The 540Ah of LFP isn't bothered by all of those loads, takes only 1/6 of the space the lead did, and weighs 600lbs less.

To put that in practical terms, we gained an entire locker space under a settee (9 cubic feet - or two 130qt containers) and the boat rose 1/2" on the waterline.

Mark

Dolphin 460 Catamaran "Reach"
Manta 40 Catamaran "Reach" - For Sale!

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
colemj is offline  
post #46 of 48 Old 05-17-2019
Senior Member
 
colemj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: On the boat cruising
Posts: 2,687
Thanks: 3
Thanked 109 Times in 104 Posts
Rep Power: 17
 
Re: What gives you a charge?

Starting an engine takes way less power than most starting batteries have. You won't notice any difference between a 860CCA and a 800CCA. I'd bet you wouldn't notice any difference with a battery half that rating.

I'd wait until you return to buy the battery - no sense letting it age while your boat is on the hard.

Mark
outbound likes this.

Dolphin 460 Catamaran "Reach"
Manta 40 Catamaran "Reach" - For Sale!

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
colemj is offline  
post #47 of 48 Old 05-28-2019 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
outbound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: NE & Windwards
Posts: 6,053
Thanks: 132
Thanked 179 Times in 172 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
Thanks to all. Especially mark &maine. Reason I’m thinking of firefly is every once in awhile there’s little wind or sun in the windwards. Especially during the summertime in the south bays of places like Grenada. If we decide to summer over instead of returning to the north east it may makes sense.
Don’t have the space or weight concerns as much so if availability increases they remain more cost efficient for us and less stressful to watch out for

s/v Hippocampus
Outbound 46
outbound is online now  
post #48 of 48 Old 05-28-2019
Senior Member
 
colemj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: On the boat cruising
Posts: 2,687
Thanks: 3
Thanked 109 Times in 104 Posts
Rep Power: 17
 
Re: What gives you a charge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Sail View Post
- The cells were very well matched from the factory, something that is getting tougher to find today
This is only a single data point, and doesn't negate the above statement, but we recently bought 4 180Ah CALB cells from a US distributor. They came with sequential serial numbers, their internal resistances were the same (at least to the two decimal places that were measured), and their capacities were within 1Ah of each other.

This is much better than the 8 CALB cells we bought in 2016, which had more variation in internal resistances and capacities.

These cells also came more over-provisioned than in the past. The 180Ah cells ranged from 208-208.9Ah capacities.

Mark

Dolphin 460 Catamaran "Reach"
Manta 40 Catamaran "Reach" - For Sale!

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
colemj is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How much would you charge? Uricanejack General Discussion (sailing related) 51 11-14-2016 07:23 PM
How Fast Can You Charge AGM Batteries? Maine Sail Electrical Systems 12 02-08-2016 12:43 PM
Can you use a jump starter to "charge" a battery Pamlicotraveler Electrical Systems 2 02-13-2015 11:10 AM
When life gives you lemons,... - San Francisco Chronicle NewsReader News Feeds 0 11-05-2012 11:00 PM
To charge or not to charge lyonsian Gear & Maintenance 27 05-13-2007 07:11 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome