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post #11 of 24 Old 08-30-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

that what I have same type with the swivel at the top and bottom. i works on the smaller spinnakers but not on my to big ones which are 1000 SQ ft ( 93 s m )and 1200 Sq ft (112 sm) the Facnor rope is not as stiff in torsion as the colligo but it is also 8 mm vs 11 mm. we are using the 11 mm colligo set up for top down and it works much better. Still we have to be very careful when doing the big sail. it has a 47' luff with a 33 ' foot. takes a bit to furl.

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post #12 of 24 Old 09-12-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Top Down Furlers

Thanks everyone. I have ordered the Karver furler with the Navrec stay. Will let you know how it goes.


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post #13 of 24 Old 09-12-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

I did a test conversion to top down on my AFX, temporarily disabling the top swivel so turning the anti twist rope would turn the head of the sail.

I did this on a day with wind speed = 0.

After lots of pulling on the furling line the top of the asymmetric started to furl after the first 3 feet (= 1 m) I stopped as I noticed that the rope where twisted a lot..

From this little test it's obvious that top down needs a better anti twist rope than the AFX central furling line design.

Checked with the local rigger, seems there is a rapid ongoing evolution with the anti twist ropes.

Mine is probably the first generation rope for the AFX system, Facnor sell better anti twist ropes and there are also others who make competing products.

The Facnor way of attaching the rope to the swivels make attaching some of these ropes a demanding task.
Facnor uses a wedge in the middle of the core to attach the rope - some of the ropes one can buy use lots of glue in the core so its difficult to get the wedge in place.
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post #14 of 24 Old 09-12-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

We are using a code zero (G0 from North) on a Schaeffer roller, but it's not this top down design. I too am very interested in hearing more. Been thinking about a asym, and this system looks intriguing. We are fractional with a good attachment point forward of everything (we made the anchor roller a little longer) so we can tension the torque rope pretty well.
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post #15 of 24 Old 09-12-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

Quote:
Originally Posted by knuterikt View Post
I did a test conversion to top down on my AFX, temporarily disabling the top swivel so turning the anti twist rope would turn the head of the sail.

I did this on a day with wind speed = 0.

After lots of pulling on the furling line the top of the asymmetric started to furl after the first 3 feet (= 1 m) I stopped as I noticed that the rope where twisted a lot..

From this little test it's obvious that top down needs a better anti twist rope than the AFX central furling line design.

Checked with the local rigger, seems there is a rapid ongoing evolution with the anti twist ropes.

Mine is probably the first generation rope for the AFX system, Facnor sell better anti twist ropes and there are also others who make competing products.

The Facnor way of attaching the rope to the swivels make attaching some of these ropes a demanding task.
Facnor uses a wedge in the middle of the core to attach the rope - some of the ropes one can buy use lots of glue in the core so its difficult to get the wedge in place.
That's good information, thanks...

I haven't yet had the chance to use a top-down furler myself, but I have some reservations whether or not they're quite there, yet...

I'm thinking about having a new Code 0 made, with the possibility of a high torsion rope built into the luff... I use the ordinary Facnor furler, and my current Code 0 has always just had a spectra luff... It takes a lot of wraps at the bottom of the sail before the furling starts to 'migrate' up to the top, and unless you twing the sheet further forward to exert a strong downward pull on the leech, you'll usually wind up with some loose sailcloth up at the top...

My water generator uses a high-torsion rope, and it's not easy stuff to deal with... One of the things I really like about my Code 0 as is, is with the softer luff, it can be stowed in an incredibly compact package. I'm concerned I'll wind up with a much bulkier package if I go with a high-torsion rope... So, we'll see, but I may wind up simply going with what I've got again, it's not that difficult to deal with...

With an asym, I still think a sock is the way to go on smaller boats, but of course I'm not sailing a boat the size of the OP... Biggest rig I've ever used a sock on was a Trintella 50 - which is a massive rig for a boat of its size - and it definitely was a challenge to manhandle when the breeze came up, we often had to lead the downhaul to a winch to begin the capture of the sail...
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post #16 of 24 Old 09-24-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim R. View Post
I just purchased a Selden GX15. I have deployed and furled the sail in light air at the slip but not while sailing. I am leaving for a 2 week cruise today and plan to use the furler extensively. I also plan to film it in operation and post to my website.

I previous had an ATN sock and tacker and did not like wrestling with it on deck. Snubbing the sail if the wind increased suddenly was always difficult and prompted me not to use it very often.
So what's the verdict? Curious to get your opinion on it.
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post #17 of 24 Old 09-24-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

I was out cruising for two weeks and used the Selden GX 15 furler 3 times. It worked great after a little tuning. I am very happy with how it works and how easy/quick it is to deploy and retrieve. I made a quick video showing how nice it works. No real specifics on the video but it shows unfurling and furling.

The real advantage IMO is that you can hoist the sail in the morning not knowing if you will use it. With the ATN sock I had to carry the huge bag up on deck and hoist the sock/sail and attach the tacker every time I wanted to use it. This usually meant I would not bother using it if I had a broad reach or DW leg less than an hour. With the furler I can easily roll it out for 5 minutes if I want.

You cannot leave it up indefinitely as there is no UV protection for the sail. We hoist it before setting out if we think we will have any broad or DW legs. It is also much easier to setup last minute if needed.

And it rolls up into a space less than half the size when it was in the sock so transporting and storing the sail/furler is much easier now.

Here is the video:
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post #18 of 24 Old 09-24-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

Looks great, thanks for sharing. Agree about the inconvenience of sock. This might be a nice addition to our inventory.

Hard say for sure in the video, but it looks like the tack is inside your bow pulpit. No sprit needed? If gybing, would you just furl/gybe/deploy? Same DW angles that you saw with the assym?
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post #19 of 24 Old 09-24-2013
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Re: Top Down Furlers

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Originally Posted by Tanley View Post
Looks great, thanks for sharing. Agree about the inconvenience of sock. This might be a nice addition to our inventory.

Hard say for sure in the video, but it looks like the tack is inside your bow pulpit. No sprit needed? If gybing, would you just furl/gybe/deploy? Same DW angles that you saw with the assym?
The tack is inside the pulpit. I have a lot of space between the headstay and the pulpit. No need for sprit on our Caliber. No need to furl when jibing. Sheets are led for outside jibing. Same procedure as if there is no furler.

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post #20 of 24 Old 01-28-2014
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Re: Top Down Furlers

I am trying to build a top down furler for my 8m yacht.
There are 2 things I dont understand.
1. Why is it necessary for the tack to be on a rotating bearing independent of the bottom unit. Could it be stationary but independent of the turning parts?
2. What causes the bottom of the sail to start turning at a certain point in the furling process when an independent swivel for the tack is fitted? I have watched the videos over and over and I can't work it out.
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