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post #11 of 26 Old 04-13-2016 Thread Starter
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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

What an awesome discussion of the pros and cons of diesel vs propane. Thanks!
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post #12 of 26 Old 04-13-2016
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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

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Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
Haven't used one, or seen one installed on a sailboat, so I have a question about diesel stoves. How does the vent work on a sailboat? I mean, the stove/oven is usually gimballed, so that it can swing to a level position when the sailboat is heeled. With propane, no problem, as there is no vent required (like hellosailor said, propane burns clean without stinking). Diesel absolutely does require a vent (yeah, hellosailor mentioned the reasons for that, too). So do diesel stoves on a sailboat have some sort of flexible exhaust vent? Not really picturing it.

Personally, my wife is a little sensitive to the smell of diesel. She can get a bit queasy feeling just from motoring downwind. So for us a diesel stove or heater is an absolute no-go.
Diesel stoves are not gimbaled. They have high fiddles and deep pots are used for cooking at sea.

Maybe I'm insensitive to diesel fumes but it's never been a problem for me except possibly when first lit. Know kerosene has never been a bother.
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post #13 of 26 Old 04-14-2016
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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrwakefield View Post
Thanks for the feedback, Sweepint.

Since we have been considering one of these units, I have a few follow-up questions if you have time:

Is your Wallas cooktop feedback regarding the single or double burner model? This was the double burner

What size was your Hewescraft? The 260 pacific cruiser, I have since pulled the unit and installed a propane stove / oven from Camp chief

Was the delay heating water due to the time for the burner top to reach max heat, or just the nature of the stove even if on high setting?
It may be the nature of the unit and the time it takes to reach max heat. If you turn it to max it will shut off do to a limiter switch that is in place so it does not over heat. This was one of the biggest problems I had with the system. There is a limit switch that will shut the system off. I had a back ground in heating so when it shut itself off I found the problem and modified it a bit. There is a blower that turns on when you close the lid... this is designed to prevent it form over heating. That is the heater part of the unit. If you turn the unit on the higher limits with the lid up it will overheat or shut itself off then you have to wait for it to cool down and re attempt to restart.

Would you be willing to elaborate on the other problems you mentioned experiencing? I have a Dickenson gas stove/oven in my CAL 39 in the galley and Wallas diesel wall unit that is ducked to the salon and berth. In the Hewescraft for heat I have a planar diesel wall unit that is ducked to the v-bert and main cabin. Fuel tank in not in the cabin but on the fishing deck so there is not diesel smell for the that aspect of the setup. Note;;;; there is no sn smell from any of these units when being used as heating while in the cabin.
Feel free to hit me up anytime on any questions
Travis

I ask as a prospective buyer...

Thanks again,

Bill

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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove



The fan in a Wallas stove/heater now runs all the time whether the lid is up or down. There should not be an overheat problem with any available current model.

I would however not recommend a Wallas stovetop for a large boat for several reasons. They are best suited for smaller boats, and even in that case the heat is at counter level, not floor level. If you are a serious cook propane is a much better fuel.

A Dickinson stove is a better choice if heat is desired as well as cooking, but they like to be left on long term. The commercial fisherman most often leave them on for days on end if not weeks and if it gets too warm just open the cabin door.

Brian
Living aboard in Victoria Harbour
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post #15 of 26 Old 04-15-2016
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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

If the fan runs all the time then it will take even longer to get to temp. The main purpose for the fan in the design was not for heating the room but to limit the unit from overheating and the company used the fan option as a rm heater selling point. This unit is a very poor excuse for a heater or cook stove and that is why it was taken out of my boat after the first year.

A Dickinson stove is a better choice if heat is desired as well as cooking, but they like to be left on long term. The commercial fisherman most often leave them on for days on end if not weeks and if it gets too warm just open the cabin door.

They can be a pain to start and the commercial fishermen leave it running because it is usually during the colder months of the year.

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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

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Originally Posted by sweepint View Post
If the fan runs all the time then it will take even longer to get to temp. The main purpose for the fan in the design was not for heating the room but to limit the unit from overheating and the company used the fan option as a rm heater selling point. This unit is a very poor excuse for a heater or cook stove and that is why it was taken out of my boat after the first year.

A Dickinson stove is a better choice if heat is desired as well as cooking, but they like to be left on long term. The commercial fisherman most often leave them on for days on end if not weeks and if it gets too warm just open the cabin door.

They can be a pain to start and the commercial fishermen leave it running because it is usually during the colder months of the year.
The fan in a Wallas does not add to start-up time as the lid is open when starting or using the stove top. As I said they are better suited to smaller boats, most often mid 20' fishing boats. I would not recommend one for a Cal 39.

A Dickinson diesel stove will light easily with the aid of the fan if the stack is tall enough. Too hot for summer use though. A coil can be added - it is an option - for heating water.

I don't think a propane stove can be beat for cooking - no smell, fast heat, and fuel efficient. Force 10 and Dickinson both have good propane products. Instant on which diesel doesn't accomplish.

Propane is very inefficient as a heating product though, and most surveyors aren't fans of them.

The most efficient heat is forced air from Wallas, Espar, and Webasto. The Wallas is the quietest by far and the only one of the three designed for marine use. None will provide hot water though.

Hydronic heaters from Espar and Webasto as well as Hurricane will provide both controlled zone heating and hot water. Their downside is both power consumption and price.

Brian
Living aboard in Victoria Harbour
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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

Thank you Travis,

Very helpful. It sounds like the cooktop had its frustrating moments.

I do have a of follow-up question if you have time:

-Did your unit have the external controller for controlling output when used as a heater? [My understanding it it is like a thermostat in function, and is external to the stove top unit...]

Thanks again for sharing your first hand experiences.

Cheers!

Bill


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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

Thank you Brian.

I appreciate the feedback about the Wallas cooktop, and concur about propane stoves.

Cheers!

Bill


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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

Yea biggest issue with any of the Dickenson diesel stoves is that it is only going to be usable in the winter, in the summer it is going to give off way to much heat into the cabin even in Alaska or Maine. I used to know a lady who had a beautiful Waterford Coal stove that made awesome bread and long cooked casseroles, but even in the winter her kitchen was 90 degrees, summer time with windows open you could not stand to be in there if she decided she wanted to make some bread in it. Oh but the steel cut oatmeal that had cooked overnight on it, that was good stuff! She always had a bowl of it for me when she knew I was coming. She had a second stove she used most of the non winter months.

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Re: LPG vs diesel for heat / hot water / stove

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrwakefield View Post

-Did your unit have the external controller for controlling output when used as a heater? [My understanding it it is like a thermostat in function, and is external to the stove top unit...]
Bill
All Wallas cooktops have a remote mounted control that is switchable between cooking (low to high) and thermostatic heat adjustment.

http://www.wallas.ca/marine-cooktop---heaters.html

There should never be a smell of diesel in a properly installed Wallas stovetop.

I agree with miatapaul that a diesel stove is too hot in summer - especially in a sailboat. Most use a small propane on top in the summer months.

Brian
Living aboard in Victoria Harbour

Last edited by mitiempo; 04-15-2016 at 10:11 PM.
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