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post #11 of 32 Old 08-19-2017
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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

I live in the tropics at anchor and have had Water cooled Isotherm ASU fridges since 1998 (We are on our second one) powered mainly by Solar & wind and I would not get another water cooled fridge,

I would make the following comments.

IMO Water cooling is old technology, the Danfoss compressors Isotherm (and most other people use now) are much better that the previous Isotherm ones at handling heat.

The Sunsail and Moorings fleets are now ALL air cooled. These boats are used/abused pretty much 24/7

In addition
• It is added maintenance tasks in cleaning filters and changing pump valves, cleaning out sea cocks
• It requires up to 2 more sea cocks
• The fridge cannot be used when the boat is out of the water
• The Isotherm parts are “eye wateringly” expensive, Look up the prices for the following sourced directly from Isotherm

• ASU (I am saving up for a 3rd one and have been running without an ASU for 4 years),
• Voltage reducers to run the water pump, (on my 4th one)
• Water pump (on my 3rd one)
The more important issue to me is to have a properly insulated top opening box which lot of production boats do not have.

Re the Engels
I have heard good 3rd hand reports of them
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post #12 of 32 Old 08-20-2017
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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triumphant View Post
I live in the tropics at anchor and have had Water cooled Isotherm ASU fridges since 1998 (We are on our second one) powered mainly by Solar & wind and I would not get another water cooled fridge,

I would make the following comments.

IMO Water cooling is old technology, the Danfoss compressors Isotherm (and most other people use now) are much better that the previous Isotherm ones at handling heat.

The Sunsail and Moorings fleets are now ALL air cooled. These boats are used/abused pretty much 24/7

In addition
• It is added maintenance tasks in cleaning filters and changing pump valves, cleaning out sea cocks
• It requires up to 2 more sea cocks
• The fridge cannot be used when the boat is out of the water
• The Isotherm parts are “eye wateringly” expensive, Look up the prices for the following sourced directly from Isotherm

• ASU (I am saving up for a 3rd one and have been running without an ASU for 4 years),
• Voltage reducers to run the water pump, (on my 4th one)
• Water pump (on my 3rd one)
The more important issue to me is to have a properly insulated top opening box which lot of production boats do not have.

Re the Engels
I have heard good 3rd hand reports of them
My Isotherm 3751 system has not required any maintenance, other than defrosting the cold plate periodically, for the past 14 years.

It did suffer from a lightning strike that took out all of my electronics, including the alternator, sailing instruments--even the engine hour meter--, and all of my LED lights. I would not count that as a weakness in the Isotherm system.

My 3751 unit is "self pumping" and has no water pump or filters. The in-water heat exchanger in the galley sink drain thru-hull has never been cleaned. The thumbnail shows the thru hull (13 yrs old) at haul-out last November.
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Last edited by fallard; 08-20-2017 at 08:26 AM. Reason: Added info.
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post #13 of 32 Old 08-20-2017
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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

Don't forget that added to the cost of your refer are the costs of large battery banks, solar arrays and regulators and wind gen and regulator... and or gen set to generate AC and or DC.

The basic electrical needs of a sailboat are: (please feel free to correct_

electronics used while under way
communications gear
autopilot will underway
interior lighting
active ventilation
navigation lights
plumbing pumps - sporadic
windlass for anchoring (usually motor is running)

and

heating
refrigeration
washing machine
air conditioning
water maker

Do you load calcs and see what size batts you need and the gear to keep them topped up.

I suspect you'll find that the refer demands a lot of amps over the course of a day.

Maybe

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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

Most weekend/ week sailboat cruising people don't have large battery banks and the do very well with the refrigeration. This is most people.

A note about water cooling; refrigerant to water heat exchange is more efficient than refrigerant to air heat exchange, it is not old tech either.

just realize all these bells and whistles on all these little refrigeration units for these boats is just that, bells and whistles. Any if not all of the 12 /24 volt units are super efficient. but look at the discussions people have about them! Even though they run in 3.5-and a half to 5 amp area, y'all still go on and on splitting hairs!

Be glad be happy, there was a time that 12 volt refridge was "impossible"!

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post #15 of 32 Old 08-20-2017 Thread Starter
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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triumphant View Post
I live in the tropics at anchor and have had Water cooled Isotherm ASU fridges since 1998 (We are on our second one) powered mainly by Solar & wind and I would not get another water cooled fridge,

I would make the following comments.

IMO Water cooling is old technology, the Danfoss compressors Isotherm (and most other people use now) are much better that the previous Isotherm ones at handling heat.

The Sunsail and Moorings fleets are now ALL air cooled. These boats are used/abused pretty much 24/7

In addition
• It is added maintenance tasks in cleaning filters and changing pump valves, cleaning out sea cocks
• It requires up to 2 more sea cocks
• The fridge cannot be used when the boat is out of the water
• The Isotherm parts are “eye wateringly” expensive, Look up the prices for the following sourced directly from Isotherm

• ASU (I am saving up for a 3rd one and have been running without an ASU for 4 years),
• Voltage reducers to run the water pump, (on my 4th one)
• Water pump (on my 3rd one)
The more important issue to me is to have a properly insulated top opening box which lot of production boats do not have.

Re the Engels
I have heard good 3rd hand reports of them

Wow, thank you. I am surprised that that you have decided to stick with this system. This is really great information. I will take my time on coming up with a solution.
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post #16 of 32 Old 08-20-2017
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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

Keel and drain condensers do NOT require a pumped water circuit.

The amount of misinfomatoin spewing out of thread is really tiring.

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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

In the for what it's worth category... I used a Grunnert 75 ED engine drive for 4 years in the Caribbean with no problem, I had on 110 watts of solar, no wind gen, no genset, a Maxwell 1500 windlass and used the SSB daily. I still use the 25 yr old engine drive refer and the only repair was to the compressor clutch and the belt replacements. We can take this down to freezer temps.

How about that!

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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

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Originally Posted by SanderO View Post
In the for what it's worth category... I used a Grunnert 75 ED engine drive for 4 years in the Caribbean with no problem, I had on 110 watts of solar, no wind gen, no genset, a Maxwell 1500 windlass and used the SSB daily. I still use the 25 yr old engine drive refer and the only repair was to the compressor clutch and the belt replacements. We can take this down to freezer temps.

How about that!
Some boats back in the day had a DC wound motor and belt drive compressor down in the bilge "somewhere" LOL

Some crafty people have taken newer engine driven compressors and set them up with DC motors also.

I'm wondering when someone will come up with wind driven re-fridge LOL

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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

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Originally Posted by deniseO30 View Post
Some boats back in the day had a DC wound motor and belt drive compressor down in the bilge "somewhere" LOL

Some crafty people have taken newer engine driven compressors and set them up with DC motors also.

I'm wondering when someone will come up with wind driven re-fridge LOL
I did the refer install... added a power take off bolted inside the flywheel... it drives 2 belts for the compressor. The install involved running the copper tubing, vacuuming them and filling them with R14 IIRC. The rest of the install was basic plumbing and mounting bits.

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Re: New refrig/rreezer, Isotherm

There is no doubt an air-cooled system and a well-insulated box is about the simplest and most convenient way to go. Engine drives require pretty complex mounting and tubing runs (depends on boat), and can't be operated unless the engine is running. Water-cooled can't be operated unless in water or an inconvenient temporary solution is devised, and requires regular maintenance of the thruhull if you are in fouling waters. Cooling from the fresh water tank is not without its own issues, like plumbing and needing water in the tank for operation when the boat is on the hard or you are away.

The current 12V air-cooled offerings work and work well. Most people with problems are really chasing installation or box design issues, and not problems with the systems themselves.

I put our BD50 thin plate evaporator system in 12yrs ago and haven't given it a second thought since. It hasn't been turned off since. When we put the boat on the hard or go traveling inland for long periods, we just leave (after emptying the fridge of short-term perishables like lettuce, etc) - everything in the boxes stays frozen/cooled while gone. Never give the fridge a second thought.

Our 4cf freezer spilling over into a 6cf reefer uses 40-60Ah/day, depending on environment and season (mostly tropic). In New England, it used 25-30Ah/day. It is dead silent, and we never worry about establishing a run schedule or routine. The only maintenance it has required in 12yrs was replacing a $9 muffin fan.

Mark
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