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post #1 of 19 Old 12-21-2019 Thread Starter
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Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)-img_4240.jpg

Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)-img_4237.jpg

First picture shows a close up. These things are a little over an inch in diameter. The second picture shows that there are many of them and they run in a straight line up the sail.

So, what are they there for? My first thought is tell tails. But? Does anyone else have these and what are their use?
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post #2 of 19 Old 12-21-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Dutchman system for auto flaking of the mainsail
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post #3 of 19 Old 12-22-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Yup....it's for a Dutchman. You can find info on it online. This seems to have fallen out of favor as help in bringing down the sail so it will flake properly. A thin plastic line is woven back and forth through the sail.
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post #4 of 19 Old 12-22-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Iím not sure the Dutchman is out of favor. I see them around. In fact, Iíd re-rig it in the OPís boat and give it a whirl.


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post #5 of 19 Old 12-22-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Fallen out of favor with who? A curious unsupported remark.

Keeping control of a main... especially a large one when not sailing can be done with any one of a few systems out there. Lazy jacks are come... stack pack is another and then there is Dutchman. I suppose each system has its benefits and deficits.

I can only compare Dutchman with no system because it's the only one I've used. It definitely helps control the 440SF main on my boat. It makes reefing faster and easier. It does require the insertion of the plastic grommets into the sail and an attached pocket sewn to the foot. A nylon line is woven from the pocket up through the grommets to the topping lift.... or an extension of it. It is important to get the tension AND the geometry correct for it to work well. And when it does it's excellent and you barely even notice it and it's excellent for single and short handed sailing.
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post #6 of 19 Old 12-22-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

As another (very happy) sailor with a Dutchman system, I also disagree with the comment that it is out of favor. Having had the Dutchman system and nothing and sailed on friends boats with lazy jacks, I much prefer the Dutchman system. Once adjusted, it makes lowering and flaking the main a piece of cake. Reefing is also easier as the Dutchman lines keep the sail on the boom so no need to use ties to keep it in place. Only downside is putting on the main in spring and taking it off in the fall is a bit more complex.
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post #7 of 19 Old 12-22-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Iíve had both and prefer the EZ Jacks ( a modified Lazy Jack) .

No extra holes in the sails. ( who recommends putting holes in sails)
No fishing line rubbing the sail fabric
Can be deployed from the cockpit
Lasts a lot longer
No special fidgeting or adjusting during spring commissioning

Thatís no saying there is anything wrong with Dutchman . Both handle the sails very well.
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post #8 of 19 Old 12-23-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

I suspect that the Dman does a few nice things that other systems don't. Of course everything is a trade off.

Dman is brilliant for keeping the sail flaked on the boom when stowed giving a compact volume for the cover. However the cover needs to have zippers for each line... not a big deal however.

Dman is also brilliant when reefing. Sail comes down to the reef in neat flakes which gives a tight compact foot. And you can easily reef from the cockpit and don't have to put ties in through the sail.

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post #9 of 19 Old 12-23-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Not sure whether you have used or tried the recent advanced ez jack systems.

Iím not denigrating the Dutchman system at all, however it doesnít really do a whole hell of a lot more than a good ez jack system. It requires sail modification. It requires cover modification. All at a cost. It is not a system you put in and can leave for letís say 5 years or so like an ez jack system is. I believe thatís why I am seeing less and less sailboats in my small area of pursuing going that way. The cost of ez jacks $300-$450 for at least a 10 year use vs a Dutchman system is quite an advantage IMHO. The fact the EZ jacks can easily be a DYI system set up in 3 hours vs a sailmaker and canvas maker involved make it very attractive. The robust lines of ez jacks must have more durability than fishing lines of Dutchman.

Ours lays it down flaked right on the boom neatly. It is contained inside the ďcarriage ď with the lines on either side. You donít have to even touch it till anchored or in a slip if you want. It seems a system which cradles the sail would be easier on it than lines running through the sail. What happens when a Dutchman line breaks and the sail spills all over the coachroof. That really isnít an issue with EZ jacks.

In terms of reefing, we have a loose footed main. Reefing doesnít mean for us using the ez jack, and put much sail material loose at the foot, and it easily is tied under the sail, without the boom essentially involved. That heartening factor isnít a necessity , but aesthetically looks neater.

I can understand why sailors with smaller boats under 40 would decide on ez jacks vs Dutchman. I have no empirical data on this.....just logic. Those who use Dutchman in my circles have mixed comments on them, once they have spent all the extra money on sail modification and canvas modification. I think maybe thatís why the sail packs have become so popular.


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post #10 of 19 Old 12-23-2019
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Re: Sail plastic gizmos (remember, there are no stupid questions)

Dave,
I have had a Dman since when it first came out... I think 3 over about 30 years... and only changed when I got a new mainsail. The Dman lasts longer than a sailcover! It likely costs more AND you do have to modify the main. But the OP was about a sail which already had the grommets in the sail so that's not an expense... What will cost... and not very much is the mono filament and some hardware. We don't know what's the deal with his sail cover. A new Dman will likely cost more than jacks. I haven't sailed much on boats with jacks so I can't crit them. I can say the Dman is easy to use, maintain, adjust (doesn't need but once at set up))... and makes reefing a snap.

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