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post #21 of 25 Old 05-25-2015
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Re: Knot failures

One of the first things I learned running bigger boats (65 feet) is that if you tie up with "yachty" cleat hitches, and then high winds and waves come in over night, you WILL be using the fire axe to get the lines off again. The last wrap with the hitch should never take any strain. If it does it can jam up and you can't get it off. An extra wrap or two before the hitch will prevent this.
Too small a line on a big cleat will slip off without extra wraps too.
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post #22 of 25 Old 05-25-2015 Thread Starter
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Re: Knot failures

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Originally Posted by capt jgwinks View Post
One of the first things I learned running bigger boats (65 feet) is that if you tie up with "yachty" cleat hitches, and then high winds and waves come in over night, you WILL be using the fire axe to get the lines off again. The last wrap with the hitch should never take any strain. If it does it can jam up and you can't get it off. An extra wrap or two before the hitch will prevent this.
Too small a line on a big cleat will slip off without extra wraps too.
That is interesting too.
So you are saying that in pictures that the correct (ASA by the book) one will jamb so hard at high loads it will have to be cut off.

So where do you take your extra wraps. An extra turn around the base or and extra cross before the tuck or both. What did you find to be the minimum needed to prevent the problem you mentioned.

This implies that if you are tying up a normal 30' to 50' boat in expected storm conditions extra wraps of the type you are going to tell me might save your lines too.

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post #23 of 25 Old 05-25-2015
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Re: Knot failures

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Originally Posted by capt jgwinks View Post
One of the first things I learned running bigger boats (65 feet) is that if you tie up with "yachty" cleat hitches, and then high winds and waves come in over night, you WILL be using the fire axe to get the lines off again. The last wrap with the hitch should never take any strain. If it does it can jam up and you can't get it off. An extra wrap or two before the hitch will prevent this.
Too small a line on a big cleat will slip off without extra wraps too.
Nonsense, no way a proper cleat hitch will jam. The final hitch can only pull on itself. You coild pinch it up under the horn, if you have too many turns around the base.


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post #24 of 25 Old 05-25-2015
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I have no experience with large boats, but Grog would seem to agree with jgwinks on this one.
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post #25 of 25 Old 05-25-2015
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Re: Knot failures

A lot of it depends on the relative sizes of rope and cleat. I can see where a rope that is too big for the cleat will jam up, essentially losing the cleat in the knot. If a rope has to be jammed under the ear of the cleat, turning it into a jam cleat, then it's not surprising that a large diameter rope would be tighter than could be easily loosened by hand. I don't see how a line properly sized for the cleat can bind up if tied right. +1 on NOT taking any extra wrap on the base. If extra wraps are taken, they should be after the standard first hitches.

I don't know how many of you have been to Green Cove Springs, where I keep my boat, but the pier is an old WWII Navy dock with GIGANTIC cleats (I mean like 3' long) that are almost humorous to use with small boats. Talk about having to take extra wraps!

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