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post #21 of 27 Old 09-29-2016
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Arcb, I have no interest in arguing about this. Your post #22 introduced ethics into the discussion, so I responded to it, and I never mentioned morality.


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post #22 of 27 Old 09-29-2016 Thread Starter
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
I'm a retired physician. Between the wife (RN) and I...
I was hoping you would weigh in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
That said if you are searched while clearing in or stopped in foreign waters and you don't have the name of the person on the supplies on the boat you're probably going to be in a whole lot of hurt. No real purpose to have meds written to the boat for cruisers. Think it would be a hassle if searched and easier to just write meds to owner.
Perhaps. That is part of what I'm running down.

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A more common hassle is that many daily meds come as 3 month supply.
In my experience this isn't awful to deal with - it just requires a bunch of communication with the prescribing physician and your insurance company.

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Difficult for the meds usually placed in a Med kit so very expensive to replace.
I agree but related but separate from my original question.

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Originally Posted by aeventyr60 View Post
In 17 years years of cruising, no official ever checked our extensive medical equipment, including prescription drugs for my name, the boat name or my wife's name.
Me either. No one has every asked to see my radio licenses (which I have) or my waste management plan (which I have) either.

"No one will check" is not a reason for me to not do the right thing, or to make sure I understand what the right thing is before it goes in a presentation or article with my name on it.

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The Australians were most interested in the sudafed...we had to record the amounts on hand and if any were consumed, it had to be recorded in the log book.
That is about crystal meth isn't it?

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The OP would like to get medications on his boat. He didn't specify whether it was just him and his wife or a mixed crew of family, freinds and unknown volunteers.
I present a lot of material and write articles. This question has come up a number of times when I talk about sailing offshore, particularly across oceans, and long-term cruising. I don't tell people what I think or want the answer to be ... I do research, preferably to original sources. The lead I got here on SailNet to the DEA Diversion Control Division was invaluable.

I KNOW most cruisers use the "understanding physician" approach. I know there is an enduring belief among some (many?) cruisers that documented boats can get controlled medication prescribed to their kits. I'm running all this down so that my future talks and articles have all the facts from credible, original sources and I have all my footnotes in order.

There is way too much opinion masquerading as fact in the world today. I'm doing my part to make up for that.
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post #23 of 27 Old 09-29-2016
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcb View Post
That's the definition of morality, not ethics, this was your post not mine.

If you don't want to discuss it, then feel free not to. Whether you want to discuss it or not, due diligence- which is related in this case to ethics and training are both factors that may be worth considering.

It is entirely the OP's choice whether he wants to take due diligence into consideration, I am not saying he has to. I am not retracting my comment because you don't think due diligence applies to first aid, medicine, legal concerns or the prescription of narcotic's, .
Quote:
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... Ethics are a matter of personal boundaries, which vary greatly.
Goodness sakes, what's got you so upset? That was unfair editing of my post. I've attached what I actually wrote.

You interpreted it your way and no one asked you to retract anything, nor has anyone opined on due diligence. Please stop putting words in my mouth.


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post #24 of 27 Old 09-29-2016
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Have been sailing for a long time but not full time,no house cruising. That starts on the 20th. However was on the dock at Village Cay in Roadtown and was boarded. They were very polite but went through every locker. Med supplies are divided roughly by need in a series of clear, waterproof bags- trauma, infection, allergy/anaphylaxis etc. They didn't open them but looked at each. Crew had left and I was alone on the boat. Still they looked at my ships papers and personal ID. They said "Oh you're a doctor " apologized for the inconvenience and left. As I watched they did not board any other boat on my pier. Went one over and boarded a old swan46 one pier over.
That night went to the bar to watch the Pats. In discussion with others was lend to believe they were responding to a tip. Came away believing it's a good idea to cross your Ts and dot your Is even when you try to be a moral, ethical person as one may end up as collateral damage in someone's else's bad behavior. Dave's search for fact is a good idea in my mind.

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post #25 of 27 Old 09-29-2016 Thread Starter
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

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If you chose to include, the "should", rather than simply the can factor in your article, actual, citable descriptions of due diligence and standard of care are easy enough to find.
Agreed. My writing style is to present the facts and then present my conclusions and recommendations. That way readers can tell the difference. Reasonable people can look at the same data and come to different conclusions.

At the moment I have set aside my previous conclusions on this issue as I collect more data and will, with more information in hand, reach and share updated conclusions. They may be the same and they may be different. Regardless they will be fact-driven and traceable.

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post #26 of 27 Old 09-29-2016
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Dave..

"No one will check" is not a reason for me to not do the right thing, or to make sure I understand what the right thing is before it goes in a presentation or article with my name on it.


Yes, we try to do the right thing and take many steps to do so. However, what is right and correct in the USA is not going to be the same in other parts of the world. So to be factual you might want to confine your articles to your actual experience and understanding from places you visit.

"That is about crystal meth isn't it?"


Yes, not being druggies we were not aware of the issue. We actually told the officials they could take it. They declined as it would involve a lot more paperwork.

"I KNOW most cruisers use the "understanding physician" approach. I know there is an enduring belief among some (many?) cruisers that documented boats can get controlled medication prescribed to their kits. I'm running all this down so that my future talks and articles have all the facts from credible, original sources and I have all my footnotes in order."

Yes, more then an understanding physician, a true professional with offshore sailing experience and a deep concern for helping us and other local sailors cruise safely. Was available by phone and email for us, which we never needed.
Never heard of the claim about documented boats being able to get controlled medications prescribed to on board medical kits, would be interesting to hear and understand how that myth started

We see a lot of cruisers making a lot of trouble for themselves by insisting on what's right. There is a lot of grey out here.


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post #27 of 27 Old 09-29-2016
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Re: Prescription medications in your kit

Duty of Care is much discussed subject in First Aid courses:

Red Cross - Apply First Aid - Demo - Red Cross Training Services Online Training


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