We should all help these poor ladies 🙄 - Page 16 - SailNet Community
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post #151 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

Not sure I see why the thread needs to close. No bad behavior or rampant personal attacks (at least beyond some members who seems to have an inherent probelem with each other). If one doesnít like the content, then skip it.


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post #152 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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Originally Posted by Sal Paradise View Post
Unfortunately, this is one example where the "slippery slope" argument surely applies. Criminalization of rescue is a bad idea. I think we lose more freedom and endanger more people than we realize with that one. It's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.


I don't exactly know where the line is between calling b.s. on a story and condemning the people who are rescued but I don't want to cross it.
To be clearer than I may have been, I was not suggesting criminalization of a rescue. I’m suggesting we have a system that forbids you from leaving the dock, on your next passage, if you require excessive rescues and don’t comply. The idea of a big fine may be what you dislike and I can understand the point that someone may not request a rescue, if they think they can’t afford it. But I will modify the various suggestions to say that none are due and payable for any rescue in itself. However, cross the line and you are simply not legally allowed to be on the water again, until you do comply. That logic currently applies to our roads and airways, so why not on the water? Too many incidents/accidents in either space, that are determined to be your fault, and you lose the privilege. Maybe you lose the privilege for a period of time, maybe until you comply with remedial training, maybe until you pay a fine. I’m open.


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Last edited by Minnewaska; 12-13-2017 at 12:50 PM.
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post #153 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

I think forbidding launching is a lot harsher from a freedom / civil liberties POV than my idea of a global DNR document.

Everyone should have the right to kill themselves however they like, long as they're not endangering others.

Obviously all aboard must be informed and agree to the DNR.

And please don't object on Green grounds, just too hypocritical as high-footprint first-worlders, we're rapidly hurtling toward our own extinction anyway no turning back now.
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post #154 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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To be clearer than I may have been, I was not suggesting criminalization of a rescue. Iím suggesting we have a system that forbids you from leaving the dock, on your next passage, if you require excessive rescues and donít comply. The idea of a big fine may be what you dislike and I can understand the point that someone may not request a rescue, if they think they canít afford it. But I will modify the various suggestions to say that none are due and payable for any rescue in itself. However, cross the line and you are simply not legally allowed to be on the water again, until you do comply. That logic currently applies to our roads and airways, so why not on the water? Too many incidents/accidents in either space, that are determined to be your fault, and you lose the privilege. Maybe you lose the privilege for a period of time, maybe until you comply with remedial training, maybe until you pay a fine. Iím open.
Boat operators should be licensed and it should be a serious standard to get the license. BUT now anyone can operate any private yacht for pleasure... That's scary.

pay attention... someone's life depends on it
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post #155 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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Boat operators should be licensed and it should be a serious standard to get the license. BUT now anyone can operate any private yacht for pleasure... That's scary.
What is scary to me is people who have the need to be enslaved. Thus, they feel the need to enslave everyone to make themselves feel better/safer. Apparently, to them, freedom is a vague concept which should be crushed at every opportunity.
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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What is scary to me is people who have the need to be enslaved. Thus, they feel the need to enslave everyone to make themselves feel better/safer. Apparently, to them, freedom is a vague concept which should be crushed at every opportunity.
This is not a matter of freedom but a matter or responsibility and cooperation in society where people share the commons.

I don't want anyone any age without any training or qualifications operating a car or a boat which could endanger the lives of innocents people.

And that would include YOU and me.

You are now in my book a persona non grata...

pay attention... someone's life depends on it
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post #157 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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This is not a matter of freedom but a matter or responsibility and cooperation in society where people share the commons.

I don't want anyone any age without any training or qualifications operating a car or a boat which could endanger the lives of innocents people.

And that would include YOU and me.

You are now in my book a persona non grata...
What about people who go hiking then get lost? Should they be required to take map reading training before hitting the trail so they don't endanger the lives of the rescuers? How about home owners who get stuck on the roof requiring the fire department to rescue them? Should those home owners require certified training on the proper method to secure ladders? At what point does this government certificate of responsibility end?

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post #158 of 204 Old 12-13-2017
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

Be glad you don't live in Canada - We do have a ladder course! Don't have it you can't use a ladder at work! Never know, might set the ladder up upside down and end up climbing down instead of up.....
We also have a joke of a required boater course(money grab) that a kid can pass, we do have a decent VHF course that is required.

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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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This is not a matter of freedom but a matter or responsibility and cooperation in society where people share the commons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skipper Jer View Post
What about people who go hiking then get lost? Should they be required to take map reading training before hitting the trail so they don't endanger the lives of the rescuers? How about home owners who get stuck on the roof requiring the fire department to rescue them? Should those home owners require certified training on the proper method to secure ladders? At what point does this government certificate of responsibility end?
Thanks Jer, you saved me from a diatribe I doubt anyone wanted to see

Freedom and responsibility go hand in hand. If you are not personally responsible and think any government can make up for that, you are soon to lose your freedom.
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Re: We should all help these poor ladies 🙄

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What about people who go hiking then get lost? Should they be required to take map reading training before hitting the trail so they don't endanger the lives of the rescuers? How about home owners who get stuck on the roof requiring the fire department to rescue them? Should those home owners require certified training on the proper method to secure ladders? At what point does this government certificate of responsibility end?
cars, trains, boats, cranes, planes, buses, are a good start

pay attention... someone's life depends on it
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