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post #81 of 105 Old 01-02-2018
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

MarkofSeaLife

It's been more than a day since your criticism regarding the word 'civilized' and no one has argued the point. Check your spelling sources, you may find that even you can make a mistake.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

I think that Mark was injecting a bit of colour into the conversation.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Quote:
Originally Posted by paulinnanaimo View Post
MarkofSeaLife

It's been more than a day since your criticism regarding the word 'civilized' and no one has argued the point. Check your spelling sources, you may find that even you can make a mistake.

One is the English spelling. One is the American spelling.
That's what made my bit funny.

If a joke needs to be explained it was not good enough.... Or to the wrong audience.


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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Sorry. I read your post again and could hardly contain myself.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

I’m curious. Most boats like yours in the 40-50’ range have AIS and radar. in the summer sail out of Barrington RI
. There’s a active shipping channel into Providence just outside that harbor. Just south of Barrington the channel is very restricted by a lighthouse on one side and rocks on the other. At low channel depths fall into the 40s so virtually all ships are both in a narrow channel and draft restricted.
So why not use your electronic aids to not even get into that area of the channel if there’s the possibility of issues with ships? I actually do this for the first time before even throwing off lines.
Similarly when transiting the gate or other areas of New York harbor have taken to monitoring 13, 9 and 16. Find 13 most helpful. Simply ask the ships what they want me to do. Then I do it. No pucker moments.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Quote:
Originally Posted by outbound View Post
I’m curious. Most boats like yours in the 40-50’ range have AIS and radar. in the summer sail out of Barrington RI
. There’s a active shipping channel into Providence just outside that harbor. Just south of Barrington the channel is very restricted by a lighthouse on one side and rocks on the other. At low channel depths fall into the 40s so virtually all ships are both in a narrow channel and draft restricted.
So why not use your electronic aids to not even get into that area of the channel if there’s the possibility of issues with ships? I actually do this for the first time before even throwing off lines.
Similarly when transiting the gate or other areas of New York harbor have taken to monitoring 13, 9 and 16. Find 13 most helpful. Simply ask the ships what they want me to do. Then I do it. No pucker moments.
I'm not sure who you are addressing, but if it is @Minnewaska in the OP, the situation that he describes would be similar to leaving Bullock Cove by the channel, and having a small sailboat zipping across the channel between Bullock Point and Annawomscutt claiming that they are the stand on vessel because of Rule 18 (the ROW hierarchy). The fact is that per Rule 9 they are not the stand on, and they are obstructing the channel.

In my experience with sailing instruction, there can be a lot of emphasis placed on Rule 18, but seemingly not as much on Rule 9.
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Last edited by eherlihy; 01-04-2018 at 11:13 AM.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Ed you’re spot on

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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Let's not conflate (a) "constrained by her draft" with (b) "restricted in her ability to maneuver". Each is a separate category in Rule 18, and in what lights are carried at night. The term "constrained in her ability to maneuver" or words to that effect, doesn't appear in the rules. It's understandable that (a) may cause (b), but not necessarily. But they are separate situations, and "*constrained* maneuverability" isn't an actual thing under the Rules.

Turning to our typical dilemma, namely the jetties or narrow buoyed approaches to it, you don't actually have the "right" to tack up that channel if you can't stay on or at least near your own starboard side of it. Rules 9a and 9b say so. What to do? Wait outside til that big tug and tow have cleared? Drop the hook close to the edge near the starboard jetty and wait it out? Short-tack the hell out of it? (good luck with that in most instances, you'll need it).

Or just don't let it get that far. Carry a handheld VHF, learn what "Securitay securitay" means and use it to ask if anyone's coming before you commit yourself to entering or exiting. And plan your trip with enough extra time that you can.

That said, I've tacked up the jetties a lot, though not in big-ship harbors. But in a boat that can short-tack up it in half the width without having to take it all. And will use radio or hand signals to advise the (powerboat) in question, or wave him by before I have to tack back out towards the middle.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
That has occurred to me. However, Rule 17(b) states the stand-on vessel, which was me according to Rule 15 (recalling that Rule 18 has been superseded), "...shall take such action as will best avoid collision". I've been instructed to make large, obvious moves, but I don't actually see that requirement in the Reg. This is a "there are rules you know" discussion, after all.
With regard to the "Large, obvious moves" It's contained in:

Rule 8b : Any action taken..."Shall be" Large enough,to be readily apparent...small adjustments of course or speed should be avoided

[/QUOTE] One could say that a full stop would have been best. I was in neutral and coasting as close to the edge of the channel as I could manage. But, defacto turns out to be incorrect, since a collision was avoided.

Still, this is a question of whether the sailboat was give way. I think they were. [/QUOTE]

I agree



[/QUOTE] 5 blasts would have been appropriate. However, Rule 9(d) says the "...vessel may use the sound signal..." It's clearly not required. [/QUOTE]

For the record....Rule 9(d) uses the word "shall" not "may"



[/QUOTE] Thanks. It was concerning, although, I was going pretty slow by then and probably would have swung hard right and full reverse about one second later. I don't recall anyone immediately behind me, but this was an active day in the harbor. Stopping in the channel would have been an obstruction to flow for sure.[/QUOTE]

Not if no-one was behind you :-)
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Last edited by tempest; 01-04-2018 at 01:07 PM.
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Re: Narrow Channels Rule 9(b)

Thanks for your input. The forward slash (/) prior to quote, denotes end of quote. I fixed them for you in my replies below. Easy fix if you want to repair/remove them at the beginning of the quotes you included. Up to you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tempest View Post

Quote:
5 blasts would have been appropriate. However, Rule 9(d) says the "...vessel may use the sound signal..." It's clearly not required.
For the record....Rule 9(d) uses the word "shall" not "may"
This is quite interesting. I just checked my copy and and confirmed it says “May”. I will go check the USCG directly.

Edit..... I checked the USCG website. Rule 9(d) says “may”. You may have seen 9(f), which says shall, but pertains to blind corners or other like obstructions.

https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/navRules/navrules.pdf

Quote:
Quote:
Thanks. It was concerning, although, I was going pretty slow by then and probably would have swung hard right and full reverse about one second later. I don't recall anyone immediately behind me, but this was an active day in the harbor. Stopping in the channel would have been an obstruction to flow for sure.
Not if no-one was behind you :-)
While I don’t recall if anyone was immediately behind me, it was a busy summer day. Stopping would definitely have disrupted flow of someone coming up soon.


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Last edited by Minnewaska; 01-04-2018 at 03:04 PM.
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