Sustainable Sailing - SailNet Community
 37Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 78 Old 04-06-2018 Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Luckybeanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 14
Thanks: 4
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 0
 
Sustainable Sailing

Hi, I've recently joined these forums, https://www.sailnet.com/forums/genera.../topics/315978, and wanted to start a discussion here about just how [self] sustainable sailing can be.

I'm sure that many of the traditionalists will immediately dismiss many of the ideas here, but the world has changed and technology has improved drastically over the last decade.

First off power. Solar has improved in efficiency drastically with some of today's panels able of around 19% efficiency, batteries have also improved in energy density and keep coming down on price. Who would have thought 10 years ago that we would have viable electric cars! So we know that we can run all house systems from solar and battery, there are even 12 volt aircons, https://evapolar.com. though how about electric motors to get us away from our reliance on fuel. I know there are companies offering turnkey electric motors at a price and a good discussion on a do it yourself here http://www.oceannavigator.com/Septem...place-diesels/. That was from 2013 when range was still a concern, I'm wondering if this is still the case? I wonder about the weight and why no own has thought of building a keen to contain batteries?

Moving on from energy and propulsion, whilst I doubt one could be fully food sustaining, I've been investigating hydroponic and airoponic solutions and wonder why more people don't grow their own food. It is amazing how much one can produce with these methods and you would just have to do a full harvest brie moving on to a new country but since you have no soil it shouldn't be an issue. I have this image of the sides of a boat filled with pvc hydroponic tubes growing greens, tomatoes, squashes and beans. On the right boat one could even turn a cabin into a grow room using one of the aircons I mention for climate control. This would allow one to grow mushrooms and even some fruit. Then there is the fact that when you find a place to anchor up for a few months, if you have been using a composting toilet, you have super rich starter to start some urban gardens to replenish stocks with.

This may ask sound far fetched, but if we don't dare to dream how will we ever reach the stars? I'm currently looking for a boat to stay implementing this idea and have jumped into this discussion https://www.sailnet.com/forums/genera.../297201?page=6 to get more advice.

Is love to hear from others on their experience with these topics, from growing food to installing electric motors and if there is anyone out there who would like to see just how far we could take this.
barryv2 likes this.
Luckybeanz is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 78 Old 04-06-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Jackson WY
Posts: 2,219
Thanks: 45
Thanked 87 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 19
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

It sounds like a workable idea if you remove the sailboat from the equation.

Jordan
West Wight Potter 14 "Lemon Drop"
Oceanside CA
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.
jephotog is offline  
post #3 of 78 Old 04-06-2018
Old soul
 
MikeOReilly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Wherever I am
Posts: 4,313
Thanks: 265
Thanked 199 Times in 186 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

I appreciate the ideas Lucky, but I do think jephotog is generally correct. Itís a lot easier, and more viable, if you remove the boat part of your equation. Doing what you discuss on land is very doable. On a smallish cruising boat, not so much.

That said, some boats are already exist with electric engines. I was direct witness to a large catamaran which went electric, and SN member mbianka has pioneered the conversion of his Nonsuch to an electric drive engine. So this is certainly possible, and will likely become more viable with the passing years.

Food production on board is a greater problem. Even with the most efficient hydroponic and airoponic systems, weíre still a long way of being able to generate enough food for two people on a typical smallish cruising boat. And while growing food is at least possible on a stationary boat, when you add the rigours of travel, wellÖ I canít see how this will ever be viable. I have read about some people growing small amounts of food on board, but these boats are not moving. And the fact remains, itís a relatively small amount of food compared to total caloric needs.

We grow fresh herbs and sprouts, which is pretty common. Beyond that I think the best you can do is turn to fishing and local scavenging for natural growing food.
SanderO and RegisteredUser like this.

Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
MikeOReilly is online now  
 
post #4 of 78 Old 04-06-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Nanaimo B.C.
Posts: 4,561
Thanks: 5
Thanked 140 Times in 139 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

May be soon there will be enough gooseneck mussel covered stuff mid ocean to sustain the protein needs of a colony . Personally .I've got plans to drift a derelict oil drill platform down to where Kiibati used to be. Raise my own flag and tomatoes..Joking aside I bartered seafoods for garden produce for many years of coastal cruising. Canning and drying when excess of daily needs. No regular job as I was good at fixing others stuff.
Capt Len is online now  
post #5 of 78 Old 04-06-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 919
Thanks: 80
Thanked 24 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

I had a kayak guide in Anacortes Washington that ate a piece of Kelp we were paddling by it and told us of the marvelous nutritional benefits of Kelp. I passed.
Rocky Mountain Breeze is offline  
post #6 of 78 Old 04-07-2018
Senior Member
 
Towguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Northern Alberta
Posts: 282
Thanks: 31
Thanked 18 Times in 18 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

Is there not a Finnish company that put an electric motor in their sailboats as a stock option....?

Northern Alberta. "85" C/L 16. ,"85"S2 7.9 under repair.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by Towguy; 04-07-2018 at 03:25 AM. Reason: Punc
Towguy is offline  
post #7 of 78 Old 04-07-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Currently, Hout Bay, South Africa
Posts: 217
Thanks: 1
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 2
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

You are on the right track for sustainability but you need a very large boat where the vegetation will not get doused with sea water. Learn to open and eat a lot of coconut. I think if you Google, "Brick House, Open a Coconut" that would be a start. An axe works far better than a machete. Coconuts are everywhere in the tropics and a food staple. There are books like "Plants of the Canoe People" by W. Arthur Whistler that describes the edible and useful tropical plants. It is not a real how to book, but if you can get a book called Fatu Hiva by Thor Heyerdahl, that is a good read about living off the land in French Polynesia in the good, very old days.
overthehorizon is online now  
post #8 of 78 Old 04-07-2018
Old soul
 
MikeOReilly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Wherever I am
Posts: 4,313
Thanks: 265
Thanked 199 Times in 186 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

I assume everyone has read "Sailing the Farm," by Ken Neumeyer. Excellent book covering food production and food scavenging. Has an extensive section on edible sea weeds. Iíve yet to try harvesting any, but now that Iím in clean salt water, I plan to.

The problem with growing food on a boat is, thereís not enough space, and youíre floating in hostile environment for most plants. Doing it on land is easy-peasy in comparison. If I wanted to be a farmer, Iíd definitely find a plot a land somewhere, instead of calling a sailboat home.

Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
MikeOReilly is online now  
post #9 of 78 Old 04-13-2018
Master Mariner
 
capta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: somewhere south of civilization
Posts: 7,810
Thanks: 167
Thanked 413 Times in 401 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luckybeanz View Post
Hi, I've recently joined these forums, https://www.sailnet.com/forums/genera.../topics/315978, and wanted to start a discussion here about just how [self] sustainable sailing can be.

I'm sure that many of the traditionalists will immediately dismiss many of the ideas here, but the world has changed and technology has improved drastically over the last decade.

First off power. Solar has improved in efficiency drastically with some of today's panels able of around 19% efficiency, batteries have also improved in energy density and keep coming down on price. Who would have thought 10 years ago that we would have viable electric cars! So we know that we can run all house systems from solar and battery, there are even 12 volt aircons, https://evapolar.com. though how about electric motors to get us away from our reliance on fuel. I know there are companies offering turnkey electric motors at a price and a good discussion on a do it yourself here. That was from 2013 when range was still a concern, I'm wondering if this is still the case? I wonder about the weight and why no own has thought of building a keen to contain batteries?.
Given enough money anything is possible, but is it actually worth it?
We live aboard, mostly on the hook, in the Caribbean. We have wind and solar power generation and it mostly keeps up with our daily needs, unless it stays cloudy or windless for a few days, which happens more than one might think. However, just as an example, our a Rutland 914i windgen averages less than a quarter of an amp per hour (6 amps per 24 hour day) annually. The reality of both systems on a small cruising boat (under 65') are a far cry from what you might imagine. Add a watermaker, a decent size fridge and freezer, a couple of computers or a TV and there are going to be plenty of days when you will need an auxiliary charging source.
12 volt air conditioning is not going to be a possibility when you really want it; a hot and windless night. As for climate control for growing things, well I doubt that would be economical even ashore, unless it was a commercial operation.
Not many edible plants grow well in the salt environment you have on a boat. A few herbs and perhaps a small tomato plant will survive for a while, but eventually in my experience, they all succumb to the marine environment, in the tropics.
Of course, with a $15,000+ bank of LI batteries, several (expensive) charging systems capable of replenishing them at a reasonable rate, one might be able to achieve what you propose. But, as all the parts of this very expensive system require maintenance and repairs, I'm not at all sure that you'd save any more money than if you had a conventional diesel generator and bought your produce from a market.
Lastly, I'm not going to put a composting system inside my home, and it sure wouldn't work if it got salt water in it, being on deck. So that one is a no go or this sailor, period.

"Any idiot can make a boat go; it takes a sailor to stop one." Spike Africa aboard the schooner Wanderer in Sausalito, Ca. 1964.
ďBelieve me, my young friend, there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.Ē ― Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

facebook.com/svskippingstone
capta is online now  
post #10 of 78 Old 04-13-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Nanaimo B.C.
Posts: 4,561
Thanks: 5
Thanked 140 Times in 139 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Sustainable Sailing

Maybe easier to change the 'expectation list' I'm pretty sure that more than several folks managed to live aboard, cruise successfully back be fore internet. Maybe hard for todays enlightened herds to imagine.it may be possible. But things are changing, Here on the left coast the oysters may not be edible unless well cooked and the herring roe has cholera And much of the forrest is suburbia . I realize that most millinials skills don't include wick trimming but needs and musthaves could be sorted to make it away. Remember back when we hippies went back to the land,started communes and hootennannyed. Most failed because the gardens didn't get watered and freedom didn't allow leaders to lead. Social change isn't easy for groups without dire needs and failure meant mom/dad sent you a Visa card. Even today an individual can make dreams come to fruition by balancing skills ambition and real needs with the effort required to obtain the needs. I was constantly learning new stuff as my gotta haves list grew Hydraulics, refrigeration fire suppression, hunting/gathering ,electronics solar on and on. Was self sufficient for many years but it took me many years. Glad I did it my way but glad I didn't have to do it all at once to be happy.
jephotog, dixiedawg and seabeau like this.
Capt Len is online now  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Want To Get Out Of The Office? This Coworking Space Is On A Sustainable Sailboat - Co NewsReader News Feeds 0 06-07-2016 08:40 AM
Sailing the World's Cup into San Francisco's sustainable waters NewsReader News Feeds 0 02-13-2013 01:50 PM
Sustainable SouthCoast offers tours of eco-friendly sailboat - SouthCoastToday.com NewsReader News Feeds 0 06-20-2007 01:15 AM
USA. US SAILING names 2006 US National Sailing Team @ BYM Sailing News NewsReader News Feeds 0 04-20-2006 03:16 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome