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post #61 of 70 Old 07-13-2018
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

Been seeing “structural stays” inside masts and booms recently. Think having a 30’ to 70’ piece of metal rod bend inside your mast or boom is the ultimate screw up for in boom or in mast systems as in either case there’s no chance you can fix it at sea or furl.
Of course being able to strike sail is more important from a safety point of view than raising sail.
The idea seems quite sound. Wondering others thoughts or experiences with structural stays? Gets around the issue of weight.

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post #62 of 70 Old 07-21-2018 Thread Starter
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

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Originally Posted by MarkofSeaLife View Post
"Possibility"... its possible that the universe is a computer program operated by Elon Musk a la Matrix.
Theres every possibility anything can happen on any boat anytime.
So lets have a better word please, and associate it with this:



In your experience how many times has it happened where the sail "isn't able to be taken down" or the problem resolved at sea?

If once per 4,000 charters I think thats fine as a risk.
If you think thats an unacceptable risk please say so.

If its once per 100 charters that to me would be an unacceptable risk.



Mark
Yes, that is an interesting perspective. We make those risk analysis decisions all the time.

In a risk-analysis matrix, you could characterize an in-mast furling problem as a lower probability, but higher consequence event (as opposed to higher probability, higher consequence, which is what we all try to avoid).

So, what is an acceptable rate of occurrence? 1 in 500? 1,000?
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post #63 of 70 Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

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Originally Posted by wingman10 View Post
So, what is an acceptable rate of occurrence? 1 in 500? 1,000?
For us, though I'm guessing, cause I'm not going to read through 7 years of sailing this IMF rig in the log, we are 1000's of times versus none on the IMF and 1 on the jib furler.
I think that puts things into perspective.

"Any idiot can make a boat go; it takes a sailor to stop one." Spike Africa aboard the schooner Wanderer in Sausalito, Ca. 1964.
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post #64 of 70 Old 07-21-2018 Thread Starter
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

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For us, though I'm guessing, cause I'm not going to read through 7 years of sailing this IMF rig in the log, we are 1000's of times versus none on the IMF and 1 on the jib furler.
I think that puts things into perspective.
So that is interesting. What specific steps have you taken to achieve that low (zero) rate of negative consequences on the IMF?
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

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Originally Posted by wingman10 View Post
So that is interesting. What specific steps have you taken to achieve that low (zero) rate of negative consequences on the IMF?
Our last main was getting baggier and baggier each time we sailed, so more and more care had to be taken each time we used it. That taught us to stop immediately if there was the slightest problem and go back a few inches or whatever was necessary. And pay attention! Watch what we were doing, always.
With the new main it was a lot easier, but we still pay close attention to the furling and unfurling. We never luff up and let the sail flog when furling. We set it and furl it on any point of sail except directly into the wind, even DDW in light air; just keep the main sheeted in amidships.
We met a couple who couldn't set their IMF without her having to go aloft to unfoul it. When we met they were pricing a new, non-RF main mast and sail! I suggested taking the sail to a sailmaker and having it flattened a bit. A $300.00 fix instead of umpteen thousand. After that, they loved their IMF.
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"Any idiot can make a boat go; it takes a sailor to stop one." Spike Africa aboard the schooner Wanderer in Sausalito, Ca. 1964.
“Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.” ― Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

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post #66 of 70 Old 07-21-2018
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

Yep. Flat is the way to go. The only time I have had trouble is when an older sails gets baggy. Restich it so it is flat and works like a dream. Want a fuller sail? Ease the outhaul a touch. Not perfect racing foil but these aren't racing sails.
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post #67 of 70 Old 08-30-2018
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

We have a 35' Beneteau with in mast furling main. It works very well. It has jammed a couple of times, but was easily corrected. I think it depends on what kind of sailing one does. We are weekend sailors in our 60s, with a 2-3 week cruise every year on Lake Michigan. If I were getting a second boat, I think I would not go with in mast furling only because it doesn't point to the wind as easily, but I would make sure I had an electric winch to raise and lower the main. That said, I have seen others have problems with their lazy jacks. If it ain't one thing, its another.
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

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We have a 35' Beneteau with in mast furling main. It works very well. It has jammed a couple of times, but was easily corrected. I think it depends on what kind of sailing one does...
Thanks Gregrosine, I've talked with friends who have had similar learning-curve experiences with in mast furling.
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

I've always felt that in-mast furling was like a centerboard:
Perfectly good if that's something you NEED. Otherwise? A critical system that has moving parts which you can't readily access when something breaks.
So, I've avoided them like the plague.
Now I'm told some of the major sparmakers and sailmakers have been paying serious attention to those issues (Maybe it was Selden and North?) because they REALLY think a reliable system could be a good seller. But I think they'll need to do "demo days" to convince those of us who are from Missouri.
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post #70 of 70 Old 03-29-2020
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Re: Pros and Cons of In-Mast Furling

I found this thread very useful.Thank you to all those who contributed.
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